The No Confidence Vote – A Trap?

Well, this is a bit embarrassing for me. In my last post I put forward my support, in a manner, in favour of the UBP proposed No Confidence Vote. Well, I’ve been thinking some more about this whole situation, and as a result, I would like to retract such support.

I want to make it clear that I am still very much upset about the decision that was made about the Uighurs and the manner in which it was done. I am also of the opinion that Dr. Brown does need a rebuking as a result of his actions on this matter.

So why have I decided not to support the No Confidence Vote?

There are two reasons.

The first one is only a minor part of my changed decision, but it was a fear that if the No Confidence Vote is successful it would see, in short order, a move to send the Uighur detainees back to Guantanamo Bay, or, worse, the People’s Republic of China. While there may be some populist reactionary support for either of these actions, to do so would in my opinion be unethical and inhumane. Sending them back to Gitmo would mean sending them back to the hell of political limbo, sending them to China would almost certainly be a death sentence for these men. We should neither commit the same wrong as the US did in the first place, nor should we commit the greater wrong of having blood on our hands. They shouldn’t have come here in the first place, but now that they are here, unless the US is willing to take them in properly, they should stay. As much as we do have domestic issues to deal with, we will deal with them, but these should not be an excuse for unethical and inhumane behaviour on our part.

I will post here, tomorrow, my answers to some FAQs regarding these four detainees, largely in a response to the xenophobic and islamophobic statements that some people have been making regarding these people. I hope they will be helpful to this debate.

The main issue why I have changed my opinion on the No Confidence Vote however is because the more I think about this fiasco the more I become convinced that the US and UK have acted together in such a way as to benefit themselves at the expense of Dr. Brown. In short, I believe that part of this fiasco is a plot to see Dr. Brown scapegoated and his Premiership ended.

I understand that people will accuse me of being rather overly conspiracy theorist here, and while it is late where I am, 0100hrs, I will do my best to explain my position. It is almost impossible for me to prove my theory, but I think anyone acquainted with similar US or UK actual conspiracies will certainly admit it has some merit.

As I noted in ‘More Thoughts on Gitmo Detainees’ I was of the opinion that the US and the UK had acted together to portray this decision as a diplomatic hiccup. In such a way the UK could claim ‘plausible deniability’ and as such escape any severe repercussions from the People’s Republic of China, which is a hugely important economic partner of the UK. The US benefits from this decision mostly by clearing up a thorn in its side as regards the Uighurs, and they have done it with the utmost of political expediency for them. They will face some public backlash to sending detainees to paradise islands, but not as much as if they had fulfilled their legal obligations and allowed the Uighurs to settle in the USA proper.

I had had some trouble thinking what the UK got out of the deal, as it seemed a winning situation more for the USA and Bermuda economically than anything else. All the UK would get was a mild rebuke from China as opposed to a full on fury. My best theory was that the UK would get some sort of concession, perhaps in defence technology, sphere of influence, business dealings or perhaps even greater military support in Afghanistan. I still believe that they no doubt will receive some such concession. However, I am also now of the opinion that one of the UK’s goals was the removal of Dr. Brown as the Premier of Bermuda.

I think the UK (and the US too) correctly predicted the public backlash that Dr. Brown would face as a result of this decision. Perhaps Dr. Brown himself also expected some backlash, but calculated it wouldn’t be all that great. It appears Dr. Brown was wrong and the UK/US were correct. More than that, I think they reckoned this public backlash would translate into calls for Dr. Brown’s head, and would result in a No Confidence Vote. In other words, the US/UK passed us a loaded gun, and they are hoping we, the Bermudian people, will pull the trigger and get rid of Dr. Brown for them.

There are various reasons why the US/UK may be in favour of this. I’ll leave those for discussion, but from the US point of view, I reckon they are mostly indifferent to whether or not Dr. Brown survives or not. As long as they don’t have any fallout from this mess, they don’t care. The UK on the other hand, as much as it may officially proclaim indifference to Bermuda staying a colony, I reckon they are probably benefitting from us remaining a colony, and would be quite happy to get rid of Dr. Brown and replace him with someone more pliable to UK interests.

Perhaps I’m wrong, maybe I’ve read too much histories of imperialist plots. But to me this looks like a trap set up by the US/UK. Bear in mind after all that the current Governor is implicated as having worked for the UK intelligence services and having a hand in the US/UK backed invasion of East Timor by Indonesia.

As I said, perhaps I’m wrong. But the more I look at it the more and more I’ve convinced this is an imperialist trap, and I for one will have no more part in it. I have ideological issues with Dr. Brown, and I strongly would like to see a policy change of the Government towards a more socialistic direction. I will shed few tears when and if Dr. Brown is no longer the Premier or Party Leader. But I will have no part in aiding and abetting a US/UK plot.

This issue needs to be debated, and I am fully aware that I cannot prove it. I am sure some will call me a conspiracy crackpot. But I smell a trap in this.

44 thoughts on “The No Confidence Vote – A Trap?

  1. Hi. American reader here, new to the conversation. Feel free to add salt.

    I strongly doubt that the US government was in any way motivated by any sentiment one way or the other with respect to your government. More likely, they were so happy to find someone who doesn’t wet the bed with fear of his own shadow, willing to take some of these poor men in, that they gave no further thought. Beyond ‘four down, thirteen to go, and only 14 days til June 25.’

  2. oh man, the back track.
    you must be hearing it huh?

    there are tonnes of conspiracy theories that could fit this situation but let’s me make one thing clear – the us and the uk don’t care who the premier of bermuda is. sorry – we just aren’t that important.

    the chinese muslims ended up in bermuda because we accepted them. and when i say we, i mean dr. b.

    obama is desperate to find them a home and close gitmo – totally desperate. brown stepped up – they prisoners were delivered. domestic politics in the us is far more important at this time then worrying about protocol between bermuda and the uk.

    possession is 9/10th of the law. we have possession of the prisoners and we won’t be sending them back. the us knows we are stuck with them and are laughing to themselves.

    as for your imperialist theory – i appreciate that it fits the lens through which you view the world, but sorry, it has no weight here.

    dr. b was played by the us. plain and simple.

    he made commitments he shouldn’t have and is playing in a league way above his level. he needs to pay the price for that.

    as for the former prisoners:

    i believe we should take them in and show them true bermuda hospitality. this post summarizes well what happened to them in the hands of the us and what is going on right now in the us:–friends-terrified-of-ex+gitmo-bartenders

    these men are caught in the middle of a firestorm and we should help them.

    as for your imperialist theory and back track:

    i have a few imperialist theories of my own on that one…and i am not talking about the us or the uk,..

    good luck to you.

  3. Hi there, Jonny,

    Over many years now there have been people inside and outside Bermuda saying something like: “If this continues … then [something dire will happen to Bermuda]” And those sleepy Bermudians with their “Why put off till tomorrow what you can possibly do the day after … attitude.” haven’t noticed that the time has come. It came some time ago.

    There’s that old expression “You cannot put the genie back in the bottle.”

    Bermuda is a violent place, it is ruled by an autocrat with an axe to grind and his odd unelected henchman, it is expensive beyond belief, has no real resources, has a public school system that stinks, is polluted.

    I was once riding on a bus in Bermuda and two ladies were talking in front of me. One said to the other “At least in Jamaica you can grow bananas … here everything is paved over. You can’t eat concrete.”

    Jonny, you have the good life. I don’t know your heritage, whether your Bermuda roots go way, way back, but I reckon you are welcomed at a uni in Edinburgh partly by virtue of being a citizen of a British territory. (For all I know, you are mostly Scottish … though that might not suit your agenda.) Perhaps you can afford your own uni fees and living expenses. If the Bermuda Government is helping you out, think about it … Will they be able to next year? Will your children be better off thanks to Dr Brown and David Burch? What will your children learn by studying the record of Dr Brown’s wheeling and dealing?

    I wonder if Dr Brown has scrapped his grandiose schemes for making agreements with China. Will the Chinese want to deal with him now?

    What to do with these gentlemen from the Gitmo prison? It is America’s problem … they nabbed them in Asia, took them to Cuba and kept them. Gitmo is not a British institution (the Americans were reluctant to hand over British detainees at Gitmo to the British).

    I refuse to believe that Obama and Clinton honestly thought Dr Ewart Brown was clearing everything with the British Government. You KNOW the US Government will have a file on Ewart Brown, they probably know more about him than any Bermudians do (he was/is American, yes?).

    Now that the world of terrorism knows where Bermuda is … will business and tourism recover and thrive?

    Who lives next to Ewart Brown? Does he have a big fence or wall? Does he have security? A shame he’s robbed so many Bermudians of what is left of their security.

    I say get him out. Paula Cox … please come forward. Your country needs you.

  4. I think you’re prescribing to malice what is probably just incompetence/stupidity.

    I don’t for a second think either the UK or US wouldn’t do this, just don’t think either care enough about BDA/Dr Brown to do something this complex.

    Dr Brown’s govn have done good things for BDA’s reputation with UK/US notable getting us off the grey list (and as far as I know the first country to do this), all major countries care about money first, and the present govn has shown to work within that mindset. (I’m not getting into a party political discussion about whether they deserve this credit).

    I think the US wanted the gitmo problem to go away, and Dr Brown said yes to that (and probably got some cash for the country/ some other benefit). And US didn’t care further than that.

    I actually would prefer that the leaders of this world were switched on enough to think about something like this, but my fear is that they are far too incompetent.

  5. “The main issue why I have changed my opinion on the No Confidence Vote however is because the more I think about this fiasco the more I become convinced that the US and UK have acted together in such a way as to benefit themselves at the expense of Dr. Brown. In short, I believe that part of this fiasco is a plot to see Dr. Brown scapegoated and his Premiership ended”.

    There is no question that the smaller fish will be sacrificed, if that is the way out of this mess or if it suits.

    But – are you saying that Brown didn’t consider this a possibility?

  6. I should make it clear that I have no problem with Dr. Brown being removed from leadership – I am not opposed to such an event. My point though was that we should consider all the possibilities that this might involve, such as the motives of a UK plot. Replace him, sure, but lets keep our eyes open.

    And the point that if he could be set up like this is a good enough reason to have him replaced, well, thats a very good point and I don’t think I can argue with it. But let’s make sure we consider all the full implications of this.

  7. Sorry Jonny,

    I’m not buying any ‘setup’theory. I do believe that maybe the US were aware that they should have been dealing with the UK government directly, however they more than likely were aware that the answer would have been a resounding HELL NO. That said, in the interest of off-loading 4 detainees they likely bargained with the wrong people purposely in order to be able to claim ignorance. The fact that they should not have been directly dealing with the Bermuda Government on such a huge issue is kindergarten international relations.

    That said, I reject the notion that this was somehow a frame-up for Brown. Both the UK and the US have conceded that the appropriate channels were not utilized. I don’t see either creating an international incident merely to remove Ewart Brown from power. You’re giving him waaaayyy too much credit.

  8. It could be that they simply are indifferent to his fate, and that is quite likely. My hypothesis though is testable – over time at least! And while you note that the US conceded the right channels were not utilised, the US also – up until that admission – had maintained that the right channels were utilised. It is very, very murky.

  9. “The main issue why I have changed my opinion on the No Confidence Vote however is because the more I think about this fiasco the more I become convinced that the US and UK have acted together in such a way as to benefit themselves at the expense of Dr. Brown. In short, I believe that part of this fiasco is a plot to see Dr. Brown scapegoated and his Premiership ended.”

    You theory is so ridiculous that it’s laughable. It’s not the US and the UK that want Dr. Brown removed, it’s people like you, Kim Swan, Shawn Crockwell, Wayne Perinchief, Casual Observer (as she has admitted here) and others.

    Unfortunately for all of you, Dr. Brown will remain the leader of the PLP and the country until he decides to move on.

    By the way, it is constitutionally impossible to have a no confidence vote in Parliament in one individual. The UBP need to ask for no confidence in the Governmemnt, not Dr. Brown.

    Just as there are some people who want Dr. Brown removed post haste, there are others of us who are very supportive of his leadership. In this instance they are the silent majority.

    Jonathan, I can understand your dislike of a man like Dr. Brown. I also can understand why others dislike him. Some people just have a problem with a strong, black man who does not kow tow. Although you have met Dr. Brown, most other people who say that they want him gone have never had a conversation with him – they see him through the eyes of Bill Zuill, Tom Vesey, Stuart Hayward and others.

    By the way Casual Observer, I have a few banana trees growing in my yard.

  10. It may be an ‘out there’ theory, but I certianly wouldn’t disregard it as easily as some. The US/UK have come up with even more ridiculous plots in their time (think about the attempts at Castro which range from legit plots involving exploding cigars and radioactive powder in his shoes to make his hair fall out!).

    LaVerne, can we please end this pathetic attempt by you and a few others to portray my dislike of Dr. Brown’s leadership and policies a personal and racial issue? My politics is quite open. Its there for anyone to read. Its quite clear that my worldview and Dr. Brown’s worldviews are radically opposed. I have in the past stated that he has the qualities to be the best PLP leader ever. I still maintain that. But he has not realised that potential and has instead consistently alienated increasing members of the community and even the Party.

    The No Confidence Vote is based on Section 59 of the Bermuda Constitution, which is:

    Tenure of office of Premier and other Ministers 59

    (1) If the House of Assembly by the affirmative votes of a majority of all the members thereof passes a resolution that it has no confidence in the Government, the Governor shall, by instrument under the Public Seal, revoke the Premier’s appointment: Provided that before so doing the Governor shall consult with the Premier and may dissolve the Legislature in accordance with the provisions of section 49(1) of this Constitution instead of revoking the Premier’s appointment.

    (2) The Governor, acting in his discretion, may by instrument under the Public Seal revoke the appointment of the Premier if at any time between the polling in a general election and the first sitting of the House of Assembly thereafter the Governor considers that, in consequence of the changes in the membership of the House of Assembly resulting from that election, the Premier will not be the member of the House best able to command the confidence of a majority of the members thereof.

    (3) The office of any Minister shall become vacant—

    (a) if for any reason other than a dissolution of the Legislature the holder thereof ceases to be a member of the House of which he was a member at the time of his appointment as a Minister;

    (b) if, under the provisions of section 31(2) of this Constitution, he is required to cease to perform his functions as a member of that House; or

    (c) if he is elected to be the President or Vice-President of the Senate or the Speaker or Deputy Speaker of the House of Assembly or is appointed to or to act in any public office specified under paragraph (a) of section 30(3) of this Constitution.

    (4) The office of any Minister other than the Premier shall become vacant—

    (a) if his appointment thereto is revoked by the Governor, acting in accordance with the advice of the Premier, by instrument under the Public Seal;

    (b) whenever the office of Premier becomes vacant; or

    (c) if he is not, at the commencement of the first Session of the Legislature after a dissolution thereof, a member of the House of which he was a member at the time of his appointment as a Minister.

    While usually a vote of no confidence does result in the dissolution of Parliament and the calling of new elections, this is not always the case, and, as per this particular situation, it is likely it would cause the resignation of Dr. Brown and the subsequent appointment of a new PLP MP as Premeir.

  11. Ms Furbert,

    For what it’s worth, my sentiment that Dr Brown needs to go is not based on anything personal. In fact, the only personal contact I have had with The Premier are a passing introduction and the congratulatory email I sent him when he emerged as leader of the PLP in which I gave him accolades and outlined my hopes as a young Bermudian for my country and the feeling that he was the man for the hour.

    Beyond that, my issues with the removal of Dr Brown revolve entirely around his autocratic style of leadership and the growing disconnect that I believe exists with the electorate. I have in the past defended Dr Brown, however his leadership style and abrasiveness can, in my opinion, no longer be defended. I think that he is a very charismatic leader and like Jonny feel that he possesses the qualities to be one of the greatest leaders our country has seen were he more of a unifying, inclusive leader.

    Interestingly your ‘list’ of individuals who would like to see Dr Brown go crosses across racial, political and even gender lines… It’s nothing ‘personal’ Ms Furbert, just individuals who want to see the best for their country and are increasingly disillusioned with Ewart Brown’s ability to provide it. Certainly there are a number of things that have taken place under Dr Brown’s watch that are NOT in the best interest of Bermuda.

  12. I believe Ms. Furbert was confusing the comments by ‘Observer’ (post #3) with ‘Casual Observer'(post #7), with the reference to banana trees in Jamaica and concrete in Bermuda. Not a big deal.

  13. Oh. Gotcha. Thanks for the clarification 😉

    Sorry Ms Furbert, I’m not the poster responsible for the posts in Post 3. Nor did I come out and say that EB needs to go. Although I do agree.

  14. Uk declaired its not going to take any detainees from early on in this saga

    US knew this all along and knew UK ment all of its territory

    Brown trying to suck up to obama combined with his blaitant efforts to break bermuda laws and constitution….(DONT HAVE A CLUE Y HE WOULD BREAK LAWS, no logical reason)

    So the US needing a sucker…I mean “humanitarion” to assist them in breaking the various INTERNATIONAL and US CONSTIUTIONAL LAWS by even having a GITMO jail…MORE LAWS broken by holding “innocent people” who turn out not to be as innocent as we are being told…

    And Brown not cunsulting any one and creating an international policy blunder that he has NO LEGAL AUTHORITY TO MAKE IN THE FIRST PLACE.

    Your position while being your opinion Starling is all wrong for these set of circumstances. LAWS HAVE BEEN AND ARE BEING BROKE AND EVERY SITTING PLP MP WhO IS NOt ON THE SIDE OF LAW NEED TO BE REMOVED FROM OFFICE.

    The opposition as usual is flawed in their approach, there should be a no confidence vote in the government cause ther majority of the MPS have not removed their support from Brown. Ther are in support of him BREAKING LAWS and therfore they are parties and equally as guilty of BREAKING LAWS




    In my opinion Starling……this is a case of sacrificing one …BROWN, for the good of the many…the PLP party….thats if u want the party to survive!!

    If not action is taken a new rift in party politics will form a new party potentially formed


  15. ‘Black Press’ my main issue is to consider the consequences that flow from my hypothesis. I am not opposed to Dr. Brown going, I think I’ve made that clear. I just think we need to keep in mind whether external forces are hoping to capitalise on our internal bloodletting.

  16. External forces will always be looking to capitilise on internal blood letting…..we should not allows fear of the unknown from doing what is correct under the LAW

    We have OECD WHITE LIST status now… they cant do much to us

  17. jonny – are ‘external forces’ really relevant at this point? Do we then have sympathy on EB for being part of some elaborate US/UK collab/setup? COMPLETELY ignoring the fact that nothing for nothing he still attempted to circumvent certain procedures and side-stepped protocol and the Constitution altogether? I seem to recall the PLP being pretty clear on their view of individuals who breach protocol (a la Horton, Perinchief & Scott). Wonder if the same applies here…

  18. Holy Crap, I’m agreeing with Laverne Furbert, to a point…..

    Johnny, I highly doubt that the UK/US Governments are conspiring against Doc Brown. I think that even to suggest this is a stretch to say the least.

    I support the vote of no confidence and I will be at the rally tomorrow.

  19. So Jonathan,

    What you are telling me, according to the constitution of Bermuda, that a majority of Members of Parliament have to agree that they have no confidence in the Government. That means that in order for the vote of no confidence to go through, some MPs who were elected because they ran on a plp ticket will have to vote for the Opposition.

    Let’s say this happens and six PLP MPs voted with the opposition, what would have then? Will those members then join the UBP or will they come hat in hand to the PLP and say, Oh, I did that just so I could get rid of Dr. Brown”?

    Either way Jonathan, that vote of no confidence put forward by the UBP shows to me that there is no one in the party has any sense, political or otherwise. Remember, the PLP has a constitution as well.

    And by the way, were you saying in your original post that Gordon Brown and Barack Obama got together to plot to remove Ewart Brown as Premier of Bermuda? You are either smoking, drinking or eating something over there in Scotland that is interfering with your ability to think rationly. Maybe you’re eating that blood pudding or “haggis” or whatever it’s called.

    You can call my remarks as a “pathetic attempt by you and a few others to portray my dislike of Dr. Brown’s leadership and policies a personal and racial issue” but until you can tell me in very clear terms that I and others can understand, why you think Dr. Brown should be removed as leader of the PLP and hence Premier of Bermuda, I will have to assume that your dislike for Dr. Brown is simply because he is a strong, black man. That’s why most people, black, white and in between don’t like him. You may see yourself as some political guru, but I see you as a person just like me who has an opinion on politics and Dr. Brown. However, the difference between you and I is that I have had more life experience and less academia than you.

    Casual Observer,

    I apologise for thinking that you were the person who made the comment about the banana trees. As I said before, the only think you, and most people know about Dr. Brown’s style of leadership is what you see through the eyes of Bill Zuill, Stuart Hayward, Tom Vesey, etc. I don’t recall seeing you at a Central Committe Meeting, an Executive Meeting of the PLP, or any other PLP meeting, so how could you say that Dr. Brown has an autocratic style of leadership? I can tell you that the battery on my home telephone has conked out because of the number of persons who have called me today who support Dr. Brown.

    I believe, that like me, Dr. Brown wants to see the best for Bermuda. If you think differently, so be it. You have the right to your opinion, and I have the right to mine. However, unlike you, my opinion is based on my personal relationship with Dr. Brown, yours is based on what the media and people like Jonathan Starling say about the man.

    I can tell you one thing, if Bermuda had 1000 Dr. Browns, there would be less black men biding their time at Westgate Correctional Facility.

    LaVerne Furbert

  20. Dr Brown’s govn have done good things for BDA’s reputation with UK/US notable getting us off the grey list (and as far as I know the first country to do this)

    I’ll be the first to say that it’s extremely important that we not be on the grey list. Reality is we should never have been on the list in the first place. If you actually look at the list you’ll see that any vaguely reputable country was already white listed. So while the spin at home is that we’re somehow “the first” it’s really not what it’s being made out to be.

  21. By the way, Jonathan, et. al, do you have any suggestions for a mew Premeier? Do you think that Kim Swan is up to the task, or should we be pushing for Shawn Crockwell?

  22. Jonathan,

    I think you’re reaching incredibly far here by suggesting this is some mass conspiracy to unseat Brown. Really, Brown was doing a good enough job of that on his own so why bother contriving an international incident to do something that will happen naturally anyway? We’re Bermuda not North Korea or Iran. Our Regiment is armed with rifles older than you or I not nukes.

    Brown has incredibly low poll ratings. Remember the rumors related to the pledge of allegance from Cabinet? How about the suggestion of backbenchers looking to stonewall his leadership until the conference? His recently failed bills and the backlash from his casino on cruise ships proposal to which he could have promised far more than he can deliver?

    Take all this into account and look a little closer to home. Does this mean the US and UK didn’t have a hand in this? Certainly not, it’s entirely possible they’ve played this to their advantage. This is politics afterall.

    However, before jumping up trying to suggest that we should discount questioning Brown’s support on the basis of what will happen to the Uighurs (of which, hopefully the people of Bermuda would be consulted), or some grand conspiracy to unseat brown perhaps it is worthwhile to examine what Brown could potentially have gained out of this action vs. what he had to lose.

    It is time the politics was removed from the situation (much like the PLP just whined about with regards to the casino vote) and a vote of conscience is made on Brown’s leadership to decide the best course forward for Bermuda.

  23. face book…. sent a message to the members of Bermudians for a Better Tomorrow.

    Subject: Protest the actions of one man…

    There will be a ‘Gathering’ at the House of Assembly at 12:30 pm on Tuesday, June 16, 2009 to march down to the Cabinet Building. This is a show of the VOICE of the people of Bermuda to ask Dr. Brown to apologize and resign. He has thrown Bermuda into an international incident with another one of his one-man decisions. We are now between superpowers USA, China and the UK. The Premier, Hon. Dr. Ewart Brown did not have authority to make this last decision regarding the Guantanamo Bay detainees. Another secret deal without consulting his own Cabinet or the Governor of Bermuda. As Dr. Brown is reported to say “This too shall pass”. No, Dr. Brown, Bermudians have had enough. This too shall not pass and be swept under the rug. We demand answers and accountability…an apology and his resignation. The Governor may decide to request that the PLP ‘nominate’ another leader.

    Send a strong message by supporting the ‘march’ and come out at 12:30 pm on Tuesday, June 16, 2009. See you there.

  24. Jon,

    The fact is that Brown did what he did. It’s his actions that count, not the motives of “the other guys”. As someone posted on BIAW, arguing that he was set up so he should be let off the hook is the same as saying someone that agrees to be the lookout for a gang of bank robbers should be released if we later find out that the gang was setting him up to be caught.

    And even if Brown really did get set up it’s even more evidence that he should go – Bermuda has enough problems, internally as well as externally, without having a leader that can be conned this easily.

  25. Yeah, I agree, as I’ve said several times, that the theory is just that, an opinion, and an ‘out there’ one at that. I personally am of the belief that the US and the UK were in collussion to send the detainess here. The UK ‘officially’ did not know for reasons of avoiding Chinese anger. The only bit that I agree is unlikely is that the UK had it out for Dr. Brown explicitly. I think it is much more likely that the US and UK recognised he would make an easy fallguy, and that benefits them, as well as Bermuda. Chinese anger against us is greatly diminished by them seeing our own bloodletting as a result of this decision.

    LaVerne, as I understand the Constitution, should the Premier lose the No Confidence Vote the Governor can choose to EITHER dissolve parliament and call a general election, OR appoint someone else who he thinks can command the majority of MPs. I think it HIGHLY unlikely that Parliament would be dissolved. I also think it HIGHLY unlikely that the Governor would appoint a UBP MP as Premeir (who would not command a majority of MPs). I would expect, say, Ms. Cox, to be appointed Premier, and a Special Delegates Convention to be called, as per the PLP Constitution, to discuss a new Party Leader, which would likely affirm Ms. Cox, in this situation.

    Okay, I will put this in easy to read langauge for your benefit then:

    I think that Dr. Brown has acted unconstitutionally as per the Bermuda Constitution, in as much as I believe this is a foriegn affairs matter and not a matter of immigration.

    As such he has also, in my understanding, acted contrary to the PLP Constitution (which says we will act according to the Bermuda Constitution and laws).

    Furthermore, I feel he has brought the Party into disrepute.

    On an ideological level – and this is different than the above question of why I think he should be reomved as Leader and Premier – I disagree with his, and the dominant Party ideology, of New Labour, which is progressive capitalism. I also disagree with his particular style of this, and his management style. As a person, I don’t have a problem with him, my issue is ideological.

    And for the record, I do not see myself as some sort of political guru or expert. I see myself as nothing more than a citizen who has an interest in politics, has a political ideology, and has no problem stating his position publically. I make mistakes. I am human. But I have no problem in voicing my opinion. Just like you. The ageism and academic bashing is unnecessary and adds nothing to your argument.

    As per your other question, I actually don’t think anyone within the Party is up to scratch to be a good leader. Ms. Cox will do okay, but I have no illussions in her as a ‘great leader’ as some do. I think Phil Perincheif could have been an okay leader as well, were he an MP.

  26. I don’t think, Johnnystar, that you credit Dr Brown with enough intelligence. Whatever your views on him might be, he is a master wheeler-dealer. This is not necessarily a compliment.

    A far more likely conspiracy theory is that Dr Brown, quite apart from ethical considerations over relocating innocent detainees, thought that by agreeing to the deal, Bermuda would be spared sanctions in the anti-tax haven and anti-reinsurance legislation going before the US Senate and Congress. It will be interesting to see if Obama’s team relaxes its views on Bermuda’s role in off-shore and reinsurance dealings.

    Well, it’s that or Brown wanted to stir the hornets’ nest that is ‘independence’. Both? Quite likely.

  27. Hi Fred, I am not for a moment dismissing the argument that Bermuda IS recieving a quid pro quo along the lines you mention. My point was just to look at it from a wider geopolitical aspect.

  28. Paula COx is not eligible to be premier cause she is standing by premier n col birtch decision to break bermuda laws by bringing these 4 people here…all politicians who side with bermuda laws being broken must be removed from office!!

  29. Ms Furbert,

    Actually, my opinion is based on my observations… when the left hand clearly doesn’t know what the right hand is doing, then there is an issue. And this has happened on a number of occassions. And no, I don’t rely on the media. As you can appreciate, Bermuda is a small place and one need not go far for information. Fruthermore, for what it’s worth, I’ve always been what you would term an independent thinker, capable of critical thought and I know when I do not like something… I don’t need to rely on others to form my own opinion, nor do I blindly follow. In my opinion, Dr Brown has overstepped his boundaries on this issue by circumventing not only the UK but his own Cabinet and the HoA and by extension the Bermudian voter.

  30. PS… FWIW, I do think that EB has what he believes are Bermuda’s best interests at heart… and therein lies the problem… “what he believes”

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  32. Laverne Said:

    I believe, that like me, Dr. Brown wants to see the best for Bermuda. If you think differently, so be it. You have the right to your opinion, and I have the right to mine. However, unlike you, my opinion is based on my personal relationship with Dr. Brown, yours is based on what the media and people like Jonathan Starling say about the man.

    For goodness sake Laverne, YOU ARE DR. BROWN’S COUSIN!!!!!
    Of course you know him more than most of the people in Bermuda.

    I don’t know about everyone, but let me tell you something about why many people don’t like Dr. Brown. I fell like a darn broken record, but here goes. HIS ACTIONS LAVERNE HIS ACTIONS!!!!
    Not all people that don’t like Dr. Brown have a political motive. The sooner you understand the better. Although from your biased view because of being related, I can understand why you may have trouble grasping the concept.

  33. Interesting stuff, Jonny.

    I am always disappointed in Laverne Furbert who cannot seem to let an opportunity go by to fill a space when a little fresh air might be a good thing.

    Ms Furbert, if you are Ewart Brown’s cousin I’m sure you would be somewhat correct in supporting a family member. I’m sure you would defend him against charges of nepotism and self-aggrandizement. But, next time you are over at his house for dinner, perhaps whisper in his ear that he really doesn’t help himself.

    I am seriously concerned, Ms Furbert, to read your remark that Ewart Brown will only stop being Leader of Bermuda when HE decides to step down. Do you also do PR work for Kim Jong-il? Bermuda is (well, was) a Western Democracy, and the PLP pushed for “one man, one vote” … But you, Ms Furbert, are saying that there is only one man, and his vote is the ONLY one that matters.

    Clever you growing a few bananas. We had them too when I was younger. Are your bananas enough to feed even your family, much less your fellow Bermudians? And would you share them in any case?

    And if 1,000 Ewart Browns would get the young black males out of Westgate, is the one Ewart Brown not up to the job. Is he out of his depth to such a degree?

    Ms Furbert, if Ewart Brown and you were really into helping people, you’d be building the replacement homeless shelter that Dale Butler is now putting off again. I’m guessing, Ms Furbert, that you’ve not spent a night in that shelter, and that Ewart Brown hasn’t either. I have. Many nights. And I’ve had days when a banana would have gone down well.

    If these Chinese gentlemen turn out to be a permanent feature of Bermuda, perhaps put them to work in the homeless shelter, get them building the new one. Not fiddling their dietary laws to prepare sweet & sour pork for the PLP elite.

    When the Chinese Government calls Ewart Brown on the carpet, are you going with him, Ms Furbert? “Please, Jiang Zemin … We’re Communists at heart … You must know that. Give us a break.”

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  35. 1905 – rev. monk kicked out for opposing the white bda power structure

    1925 – garveryites kicked out for opposing the white bda power

    1945 – dr. gordon is tried to be kicked out for opposing the white bda power structure

    1965 – ottie simmons/biu is attacked for opposing the white bda power structure

    1985 – lois brown evans attacked for possibly being a communist for opposing the white bda power structure

    1998 – the island is spooked by a plp govt. chasing away ib…etc

    u get the picture – when will blk people ever get (cas ob. etc.)

    on the plantation the blk alpha male was always removed and replaced the the clown negro

    dr. brown – kim swan hmmm

    cas observer u and other blk people’s take on dr. brown is just and educated version of blk on blk crime

    blk men are more likely to be killed by other blk men – core reason: self hatred (poverty etc, follow)]

    if bda let the white power structure once again remove a blk alpha male from power – even if they’ve tricked blk people into hating the best of themselves

    bda might as well cal it a day – it’s a wrap – unlike the rest of the post colonial world u and ur kids will be slaves forever

  36. Well, their motto years ago was “by any means neccessary”…damn…kissing cousins of the BBC. Blood is thicker than water and vows made years ago.

  37. Some of you blast Ms furbert for supporting Dr Brown.

    But some of you would blast Dr Brown for any and every decision he makes, simply because he is the one behind it. How many of you actually sit down, deliberate, and have an objective think about the issues and policies? Or do you react emotionally to everything based on his involvement?

  38. “People like Jonathan Starling…”?

    What kind of people is THAT?

    PLP supporters? Labour supporters?

    Or is there something else to which you’re referring?

  39. “Jonathan, I can understand your dislike of a man like Dr. Brown. I also can understand why others dislike him. Some people just have a problem with a strong, black man who does not kow tow. Although you have met Dr. Brown, most other people who say that they want him gone have never had a conversation with him – they see him through the eyes of Bill Zuill, Tom Vesey, Stuart Hayward and others”.

    Just a suggestion Ms Furbert. You really should not accuse people of being idiots and fools. It may come as a surprise to you, but there others in Bermuda (apart from Dr Brown and yourself) who are quite discerning, and also have a reasonably high intellect.

    Indeed, some of us even managed a degree (like you and Dr Brown), so we are quite able to make up our own minds and do not have to rely upon the likes of Vesey, Hayward et al.

    Sorry to disappoint.

  40. I forgot to add…

    It is not a case of a strong, black man not kow towing.

    It is a case of his utter disrespect for Bermudians, his Cabinet and in the broadest sense Bermuda, through his actions.

  41. LF: “Just as there are some people who want Dr. Brown removed post haste, there are others of us who are very supportive of his leadership. In this instance they are the silent majority.”

    So, any clue as to why they are suddenly so silent?

  42. LaVerne Furbert wrote:

    “Let’s say this happens and six PLP MPs voted with the opposition, what would have then? Will those members then join the UBP or will they come hat in hand to the PLP and say, Oh, I did that just so I could get rid of Dr. Brown”?

    Either way Jonathan, that vote of no confidence put forward by the UBP shows to me that there is no one in the party has any sense, political or otherwise. Remember, the PLP has a constitution as well.”

    To Ms. Furbert:

    Do your words above imply that the MPs loyalties should be with their Party and its Constitution, above their responsibilities to their constituents? It certainly sounds that way.

    And with regard to strong black men that don’t kow tow, your statement is breathtaking in its simplicity and prejudice. You know nothing of me, but are content to assert that you know why I dislike Dr. Brown.

    Let me help. I don’t much care what color Dr. Brown is. I don’t like dishonest people (Commissioner Jackson assertions). I don’t like people that have no respect for the law (Uighur process; BIU/UAH contract). I don’t like people in government that favor the few over the many (GlobalHue; NY Tourist Office; UAH/BIU). I don’t like people that don’t take responsibility for their words (UAH/BIU/AG). And I especially don’t like people that, when challenged, resort to race as the source of their ills, or otherwise disparage the messenger without addressing the message (Rally yesterday; AG). Through his own words, Ms. Furbert. Not from the RG, not from anyone else. His words.

    The great news is that it matters little to me what they look like, or what color their skin happens to be. If Dr. Brown was Asian, or Causcasian, or a native of Jupiter, based on his actions, I STILL wouldn’t like him.

    Hope that helps.

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