1000hrs. Labour on the March.

No time to write now. We heading out. Use this thread to discuss the march. I ask all workers, union or other, to join us.

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236 thoughts on “1000hrs. Labour on the March.

  1. I did my best. Rowland lent me an anarch-syndicalist flag, I’ll write more about its significance in a separate post. Its essentailly a red and black flag bisected diagonally, and in short, the red represents the ideals fo socialism and the blood of the struggle, the black represents the negation of nationalism and the ideals of anarchy. If I’m in any pictures I’m the guy with the red and black flag. Couldn’t quite get a good breeze, and when I did I found my pole was too short and I was slapping people in the face as it was pretty crowded.

    Anyway, what happened?

    The BAMZ workers left en masse just after 0900hrs to rendevous with our BPSU brothers and sisters. Between 0930 and 1000hrs we were simply amassing. At just about 1000hrs we recieved news that the Electrical Supply Union workers had held an emergency meeting and decided to walk off the job site and join ranks with the BPSU. The Prison Officers also then joined us. On their arrival they were met with mass applause and shouts of solidarity. We then recieved word that the Police were falling in to formation, and that the BUT had voted to join us, and were begining to leave from their HQ. Just as we were about to set off we recieved word that the BIU had voted to join us, and had already left from their HQ.

    With all the above our moral was super high and we swarmed out of the BPSU HQ and took over Cedar Avenue. We marched up to Reid Street and towards the House of Assembly. All the way we were greeted with solidarity from pedestrians and non-unionised workers and drivers. At the intersection of Parliament and Reid we saluted the BUT, the Police and the BIU, and then marched on Parliament. The BPSU contingent largely occupied the Western and Southern slopes. The BUT followed after us, occupying the Eastern and Southern slopes. The BIU mostly stayed outside on Parliament street, providing a drum band.

    As we were all sitting and enjoying the scene a large wave of applause started from Reid and Parliament, and then we saw the cause. Several hundred police officers, in uniform and out were marching in formation and marched right up the steps into the House of Assembly. The sight was stunning.

    Due to our numbers it wasn’t possible for all of us to see what was going on, but information rippled throughout the masses. As I understand it Dr. Brown went into hiding and didn’t bother showing his face, leaving the Minister of Labour, Col. Burch, to bear the brunt of the anger. As we left to return to our respective HQs for a quick debrief we left sentries around the House of Assembly. Dr. Brown emerged after the bulk, say 95% of the workers had left. As news of this snub went through us on our way back, all I can say is that Dr. Browns credibility took a distinct plunge. While he may have been met by boos had he shown up, people were calling to egg him the next time for this snub. He is now regarded as a coward, and many in the crowd, including Party members were openly calling him a national disgrace. Others were calling for his immediate resignation and a general strike to bring him down. His snub will be well remembered and not easily forgiven.

    What happens now? Thats up to Government. If they want a general strike, they’ll get one. We are ready for it, and we have the support of the people.

  2. One disappointment is that there seemed to have been a communication problem within the BIU. Their Works and Engineering division was out in force, but the public transportation people seemed unaware of the BIU meeting and would have liked to have joined but didn’t know about it. Lots of them said they will be speaking with the Union leadership to ensure they are present for the rest of this summers actions. At least thats what I got from speaking with the bus drivers after the rally.

  3. Hey Jonny, just to let you know I have sent a report of todays actions to the IWW General HQ, and I expect to hear back from them soon.

  4. Glad to see you guys coming around. To think, only a few days ago you were spitting your tea at the thought of throwing out Brown.

    The problem is that anyone in the PLP who might replace him and Burch are incompetent at running anything.

  5. This is what happens when a Government sets itself apart from the people that it is supposed to serve, throws all political and social ideology out the window and shows complete contempt for the electorate.

    I wouldn’t ordinarily have a problem with the Government challenging arbitration awards that appear to be ultra vires, and have said as much on this site, but one cannot view the Government’s decisions in that regard in a vacuum. At a time when the Government has demonstrated a complete disregard for fiscal prudence and restraint (top-of-the-line BMWs, exorbitant travel expenditure, Faith-Based Tourism scams, etc) the Government’s decision to challenge the arbitration awards is hypocritical, to say the least, and is a massive slap in the faces of the workers.

  6. I wonder sometimes DeOnion whether you actually read our past writings. Not aware of any writing of mine that would warrant your observations there.

    Not sure about your second comment at all. There are plenty competent people within the Party. I wouldn’t even call the current leadership incompetent.

  7. It would be refreshing if this site did not take up the hysterics of ‘that’ other site. Expressing opinion is one thing – to which we are all entitled – but care needs to be taken as to how it is expressed.

    John – on a totally irrelevant note – the icons representing opinions on the left are reacting strangely. Some work – others do not. Also, I clicked on Vanz – and got Vanz.com. Am I missing something?

  8. By icons I think you are talking about the computer generated symbols unique to each user. Those are a feature of WordPress and I don’t control them, but I can switch them off if necessary. I think WordPress is doing some updating work, as other aspects of the site are not running as smoothly as normal. I expect things to return to normal shortly, as I’ve encountered similar situations in the past.

    As for clicking on Vanz’s icon, anyone who chooses to leave a url can do so, and many posters make up erroneous ones. Vanz has used vanz.com, a nonsense url for some time. I found it suprising he chose not to use his blogs url, but that is his own choice. DeOnion has a url attached to his name, that will take you to his blog http://www.newonion.com. Not sure if that answers your questions, but I’ll keep on eye on the sites running for now.

  9. They are wildly incompetent. Despite their best attempts to hide it, the Auditor General’s reports and other objective sources of data paint a clear picture of across the board fundamental managerial incompetence. This is not new to the Brown administration, and I am sure that if you dig behind your reasons for seeking global socialist revolution, you will find that your fundamental human principles are not well served by the ongoing poor decision making of the PLP (with the exception of election time). It is a prior generation of PLP leaders responsible for the housing crisis, education disaster, and a dozen other inexcusable maladies we suffer today. Repeating the tired line about the UBP being a dinosaur is intellectually lazy and you know it.

    Some time ago you asked me for proof that the PLP ministers were off the rails and you dismissed me because I could not give proof (because the matter is going to court). While I regret what is happening to this arbitration, I am glad on some level that the labour movement is finally experiencing what the rest of us have been dealing with for years.

  10. Laverne Furbert’s head must be exploding as she tries to figure out how to write a letter to the editor criticising the unions for being disloyal to the labour cause as vested in the personage of the glorious leader of the PLP. Who, by the way, asked her to remind everyone that he is not an elitist.

  11. Just finished speaking to a number of the dockworkers. They were quite upset that they weren’t able to attend. They said the first they new that something was up was when the House of Assembly was already surrounded and it was too late for them to form an emergency meeting and march off the docks to join. They all voiced support for the action and were embarrassed that they weren’t there to lend support.

    The best theory that they came up with about why they were not notified was that there might have been concern of the information being leaked to the Party Leadership in advance of the actions, with the BIU leadership being percieved as very close to the PLP. This may very well be the case. I don’t know. There were plenty of Party people out within the demo as part of the demo, and even PLP hats and hand fans, so beats me what happened.

    The important thing is that they all seem to have voiced solidarity and say they’ll join the next one. I’m sure they’ll be speaking to their union reps about what happened to make sure this failure of communication doesn’t happen again. In the mean time, we’ll be calling them (docks and PTB) right before the next demo to let them know to form an emergency shop floor meeting to join us.

  12. Well… it seems the PLP Leadership has achieved their ultimate goal by bringing all the workers & Union’s together in complete solidarity.

  13. “Firstly, thankyou to all of you who particpated in the demonstration today. Also, thankyou to all the kind words of solidarity on this site.”

    js – u thanked the readers on bdasux for words of solidarity – yet “clash” w/ “sister furbert” on your own site – justthink BOUT THAT for a sec – not that u can’t disagree w/ a party member – but to go on bdasux and THANK THEM – i’m baffled – truly

  14. Vanz,

    The site Bda Sucks is no more an anti-PLP site than it is a pro-UBP site. The failure for pro-PLPers to balance that site is a separate question; however there have been great increases in the level of balance there, and I encourage more PLPers to engage in dialouge there.

    What is it that you are asking me to think about? That I chose to go on a free forum that happens to be the most popular online forum for discussing all things Bermudian, and post on a thread full of support for the democratic action of organised labour, and thank them for their support for an action that I was a part of? Is that honestly what you are asking me? As for ‘clashing with Sister Furbert’ your mother chose to post on my blog. I welcome her to continue doing so, but stress this site is not under Party control and is for the free and frank discussion of ideas. Just because she is a member of my Party does not warrant her a carte blanche on this or any other site. Unless I wildly misinterpreted her comments she levelled a veiled threat on me and added some completely irrelevant information about my place of work and what I percieve to be an attack on my workers democratic organisation of labour for reasons that are a mystery I reckon to most of my readers to this site, pro-PLP and other. I have my own particular believes as to her motivation, but see no point to bring that up – perhaps you know them and would care to explain?

    I thank a thread on Bda Sucks. And you interpret that as condoning all that is on that site? You seek to judge a free forum by the actions of its worst minority? And not by it moderate majority or progressive minority?

    Think about what? That a desparate bunch of Party apparatchiks who for so long wandered in the political ghetto are now so dazzled by power that they forget that they are a labour party and continues to out-UBP the UBP and are upset that the grassroots are pissed off? I do think about that. Perhaps more in the Party should think about that. Perhaps you should think about that.

    Yes the UBP will try to use this to their advantage. THEY ARE IRRELEVANT. That is more a bogeyman to suppress the neccessary far reaching change that is needed in our Party to sweep out the opportunists within. A bogeyman deployed by those very opportunists that seek to save themselves.

    The media will use this to divide. Maybe. But the true dividers of the Party are those who have hijacked the Party and are actively denigrating the proud legacy of liberation that the initials PLP are supposed to stand for.

    You are baffled? Sir, I am baffled, amazed at your comments. I no more speak for the Party than you or your mother LaVerne. But quite frankly I feel there is a greater chance that I am closer to the mark of the grassroots and the majority of the Party than you, LaVerne or even Dr. Brown.

    We have had a massive labour demonstration against the PLP Government. Party members were openly opposing the actions of the parliamentary PLP. Think about that my friend.

    Had PM been actually in the hands of the youth wing and posting messages of solidarity – which the majority of its members I have spoken with are – I would similarly have posted there. But PM is no longer controlled by the youth wing, and has not been since the run up to the election. And no messages of support were there, so I did not post there. Think about that friend.

    Do not all these things baffle you?

  15. Little surprised Vanz at the remarks.

    Not everyone on BDS is anti PLP – neither are they pro UBP. Some are just concerned about this island and it’s future. Go back to LIB and re-read the comments that were made when Ewart became Premier.

    Many were pleased to see him elected, thinking that Alex was ‘lame’ and ‘here was a man that might be good for the country and get things done…let’s see how he does’.

    Well, sadly, he f….d it. And I say that as a socialist. Nowhere close to John’s politics – but a socialist nonetheless.

    John didn’t clash with Ms Furbert – she raised the stakes by going live. Hence my question earlier…I am surprised John was slapped in public. Mistakes all round I think!

  16. You know, it just gets more pathetic. How can PLP supporters be so cynical as to come out, guns blazing, against a pro-labour, pro-PLP activist such as Jonathan? I don’t agree with his far-left politics but, good God, at least he’s a true conviction activist who hasn’t become so seduced by power and its trappings that he’s forgotten what the hell he stood for in the first place. Here is a guy who is unashamedly nailing his colours to the mast, saying what he stands for and calling out his own party leadership for casting aside true ideology for the sake of politics and ego. He’s the bad guy here? Seriously? Some people need to take a long, hard look in the mirror and ask themselves what their motivations are and question whether they’ve sold out. I won’t be voting PLP anytime soon, and I won’t be converting to Jonathan’s political views, either, but God bless him for standing by his beliefs and refusing to bow down before the Party elite. Shame on those of you who seem intent on crushing all dissent.

  17. js, do me a favour – read teh Joe Mills chapter in The History of the BIU – read about at the height of solidarity the steverdores planted lies about joe mills and caused the workers to split into 2 unions – diluting there leveraging power.

    the read the section about how belco on the verge of solidarity had belco managemnt plant seeds of discourse and cause belco to have 2 unions again diluting their power – or in the 80s when the labour party was closing in on power – infighting and sexism caused them to split and the power was diluted.

    wil allen, joe mills, ira phillip, dr. gordon dr. cann all had a vision for unity between the political and labour movement – joe mills was an admitted under educated dockworker dr. cann a scientist and so on.

    i see that split going on because 1.) the biu expects too much – 2, the plp wants to give too little and three – some peopel cannot stand seeing a businessman running the labour party

    i think u have legit reasons js for ur unease – ur a marxist – but most of the party – heck most of the union isn`t – there has to be a compromise. – the wrokers who started biu asked for dr. cann and dr. gordon to lead them because they were in essence the elite – not elitist – but elite orators elite men of science etc.

    dr. brown is from a upper middle class family – like g gibbons he`s worked hard and likes to enjoy his success – that`s his real crime (read the stranger) or watch the jack johnson doc. to see what i`m getting at about somepeople`s dislike of seeing blk men wé nice things

    js, u seem to be taking glee in the hemoraging that`s occuring btw the plp of today and the biu etc. – workers suffered when the belco union split, when the dockworkers split and when the plp split – and trust me – if this split happens it`s biz as usual – workers suffer and tenhhaterz laff at having detroyed something they despise.

    now i belive that gordon, allen et al had a long term plan for the special relationship between teh plp anxdc biu – but in ur wisdom if u feel that that connect needs to be crushed – that`s sad – and if you feel that it`s just the current elected leadership that u don`t like – then maybe pull a warlord move and have them removed until in spite of elections – the plp leadership is someone u like – i`m typing this late so pls excuse the rambling and typos.

    i`d rather explain this over the phone but if u`d rather i not – mention so here or email me as such.

    peace

    vc

  18. “workers suffered when the belco union split, when the dockworkers split and when the plp split – and trust me – if this split happens it`s biz as usual – workers suffer and tenhhaterz laff at having detroyed something they despise”.

    Aren’t they suffering now? Wasn’t that at least part of the point made yesterday?

  19. Morning Vanz,

    Don’t have too much time to spend typing right now, so forgive me if this is brief.

    I am well aware of the labour history of Bermuda, the splits and so forth and the need to ‘Be Watchful Always’ as the acronym for the Bermuda Workers Association – the forerunner of organised labour in Bermuda – doubled as.

    Not all enemies of the working class and the liberation movement are external to the movement. We have to constantly ‘be watchful always’ for the regeneration of capitalist mindsets and opportunism that springs forth from within the very ranks of the movement. If there is a split going on in the Party, it is not due to external factors, but due to the system itself. The enemies of labour today come from those that profess to represent labour. The demo yesterday displayed the growing disconnect between the grassroots and the Party Line.

    I assure you I take no glee in seeing this happen. But what do you ask? That to prevent a split the grassroots should roll over and allow for their continued exploitation and the betrayal of the movement by its leadership? No, that I will not do. That may be one way to achieve the peace; another is for the leadership to capitulate, for the opportunists to be run out and for the deepening of political and economic democracy.

    There are some who mistake me as being anti-Brown, of working for a rival faction, a Coxite, a Scottite or a Smithite. I assure you this is not the case. Any long-term review of my writings, be it here, or on other sites or even in numerous letters to the editor over the last ten years will show this is not the case. I have attempted a consistent critique of the direction of the Party essentially since 1999. This critique stems from my libertarian Marxism as it clashes with the dominant ‘third way Blairism/Mbekism’ that characterises the current PLP. I really don’t have much faith in any of the potential rivals to Dr. Brown as being substantially different, and can forsee my criticism to continue under any leadership change.

    True, my ‘far-left’ politics is nowhere near shared by broad swathes of the Party or its supporters. But I think you will be suprised at the common positions that do exist; that many are in fact in broad agreement with my ideals if only the particular jargon unique to politricks and Marxist theory are left out. I am not expecting a libertarian Marxist social and political revolution any time soon.

    My role for now is to provide a libertarian Marxist critique – as best I can – of the current situation, to defend the Party when I feel it warranted (namely the covert racism assaults on it), and to both encourage and help develop those groups within the Party and without that I share common positions with, be it on anti-capitalism, anti-racism, anti-sexism or anti-imperialism.

    I do not know how else to point out that the UBP is currently irrelevant. There is nothing to worry about frank internal discussion; does not our Party – in rhetoric at least – thrive on the concept of unity in diversity?

    The split, if it exists, is not being caused by the grassroots. The split is a reaction to the talk left, walk right of the Party system as a whole.

    Peace.

  20. your points are taken but i still disagree w/ ur public airing (airing it at the biu, alaska hall etc – ia juat A EFFECTIVE) airing it it anti plp sites is destructive because it presents an unintended bandwagon for others (without good intentions) to jump on and bash the plp – that’s all i’m saying – just as u would not want biu dirty laundry displayed so that mamagment can use ut against said biu – i feel the same about the plp

    and re; bda sux – i suggest doa msearch – type in biu and read all of the nasty things that “those who have supported you” said about the biu overthe years – on eo fteh naion posters there rummy have actually blamed the biu for causing the belco riots and he holds them responsible for the injuries sustaimed by the good policeman who were just trying to keep the peace – that’s who u are unintentionally aligning urself w/ when u thank them – not to mention the posters there who blame the fall of tourism on ottie simmons personally for demanding equal pay for unionised hotel workers – that’s just a few – again – i don’t disagree – as a matter fact i have several goiod friends in south africa who are marxist lenninist – i just think the way ur doing it (even if the ubp is a non issue) is going ti coem back to haunt labour – not unlike hillary clintons anti obama statements( i know u don’t like either if them in re; to labour) are now bwing used by the republicans

  21. again js – pls go and read why the carpenters up at the US base who started the forerunner of the biu – read about their reasoning for choosing the “elitist” dr. brown and dr. cann as their politcal arm =- better yet call ira phillip and talk to him about how important dr. brown is in the workers struggle

  22. Vanz,

    I know the labour history. If you would care to provide some elaboration to visitors to this site, feel free to do so here. I do not see the need for myself to go out of my way and write a post on it – I welcome you to do so; I’ll even make it an open mike if you email it to me. I welcome all such contributions, but reserve the right to (a) provide a brief intro with the disclaimer that the views are expressed are those of the contributor alone; (b) reserve the right to review it prior to publication in order to ensure it avoids personal attacks, potential slander or over the top obscenities and (c) reserve the right to critique it in the comments section.

    So the movement has always been a union of the depressed elite and the oppressed working classes. So the main leaders of the movement have been leaders of the union and those emmbers of the elite who hared the vision. I fail to see your point.

    I am not critiquing Dr. Brown because he is Dr. Brown. I have said before that I think he is perhaps our best potential leader, and in many ways in practice. I am critiquing more the ideology that he is symptomatic of, and to a lesser degree his blunders of late that only compound the systemic problem of our Party.

    The Party needs nothing to fear of open and frank discussion of all matters relating to the Party and the movement. This not only helps raise the general consciousness of the movement and increase the willingness to participate, but it also helps bring in new members. There are many out there who have preconceptions of the Party as overly authoritarian and dogmatic. These same people often have similar ideals to those that our Party in rhetoric represents. An ability to demonstrate that the Party has nothing to fear of wide ranging criticism from within and possesses a vibrant internal democratic spirit only benefits the Party in the long run. Attempts to stifle such freedom of thought only run contrary to these goals.

    You feel that my open and frank discussion will come back to haunt labour; I feel the reverse is true, that business as normal Party Line dogmatism will haunt the Party. In many ways this has already happened, as is seen with the very public disconnect that the demo on parliament indicated.

    On your conception of Bda Sucks, again, yes, lots of negativity does exist on that site as regards the movement. You chose to attempt to disrupt dialouge there. I choose to engage it with the aim of (a) balancing out the discussion and (b) bringing people over to the movement through rational discourse. I’ll leave it to the visitors who frequent both sites to determine which strategy has the best results. And even where that site has been negative of the movement in the past, it is important to acknowledge the times when it has been positive.

    As your mother LaVerne has been so kind to announce, I work at the Aquarium. One of my roles there is as an animal trainer. Another of my roles is in the capacity of an educator type person for Bermuda’s natural history. If there is one thing I have learned from these two related tasks, positive reinforcement is by far more efficient than negative reinforcement and punishment.

    It is important to give criticism where it is due and applaud when it is also due. I am aware the media has its own agenda separate to mine, but the readers of that paper also know it. I can defend myself here, and will do so in the other media also when necessary. My conscience remains clear.

  23. Jonathan,

    As the BIU was no “officially” involved in yesterday’s protest march, can you explain to me why the protest was called. I’ve heard conflicting reports from members of the BPSU.

    Thanks,

    LaVerne Furbert

    By the way, I didn’t know it was a secret that you worked at the Aquarium. Everybody knows where I work and they have no problem putting that information on your site. On another note, I don’t think I’ve ever read where Vanz refers to LaVerne Furbert as his mother. Why do you keep making references to his mother. I don’t post as Vanz’s mother and he doesn’t post as LaVerne Furbert’s son. We’re both individual adults who share some of the same ideals. Just because we don’t post anonymously doesn’t give you the authority to talk about our relationship. I think you would be pretty upset if I made reference to your mother, just as I know the other posters would be upset if I made references to their mothers. Enough is enough!!

  24. “By the way, I didn’t know it was a secret that you worked at the Aquarium. Everybody knows where I work and they have no problem putting that information on your site. On another note, I don’t think I’ve ever read where Vanz refers to LaVerne Furbert as his mother. Why do you keep making references to his mother. I don’t post as Vanz’s mother and he doesn’t post as LaVerne Furbert’s son. We’re both individual adults who share some of the same ideals. Just because we don’t post anonymously doesn’t give you the authority to talk about our relationship. I think you would be pretty upset if I made reference to your mother, just as I know the other posters would be upset if I made references to their mothers. Enough is enough!!”

    ……………says the person that, not only issued a thinly-veiled threat to Phil Wells regarding the renewal of his work permit, but who also publicly disclosed the workplace of his wife, just in case anyone ‘on message’ felt like taking some ‘direct action’. Hypocritical much, LaVerne?

  25. LaVerne,

    You are correct. I will attempt to not refer to you in the context of Vanz’s mother. As for references to mothers, and how I would feel about you speaking of my mother, well, context is the key really. As stated though, I will do my best to not refer to the family relationship between you and Vanz except where the context is absolutely necessary.

    It is no secret about where I work, no. At the same time I did not advertise where I work. But I still see no relevance in you having brought it up. Perhaps if you would care to explain your reasons for doing so that would help?

    As for the march, I think it is better that you address that question to either the BPSU President or its General Secretary. Or the leaders of the other Unions involved. They have the minutes and can give you the official motion that we voted on, leading to the march. Their quotes in the media however should be sufficient. Not all members happened to be writing down the notes, and many had different reasons relating to their particular workplaces, and this march was an expression of their frustrations, with the Governments actions towards the arbitration rulings being a catalyst.

    Perhaps you can explain why the BIU was not officially involved, or why only the Works and Engineering division were present, or why they were marching?

  26. I see no reason for you to ever refer to me as Vanz’s mother on this blog, or any other blog. As I said previously Vanz’ posts as an individual and I post as an individual.

    The reason I mentioned the Aquarium, again as I stated previously, I know that the Aquarium workers fought tooth and nail not be become unionised. However, your account of what happened in that situation is far from reality. Agency shop means agency shop – not specific departments of Government agreeing or disagreeing. Again, speak to those with some authority and find out the truth of the matter.

    As far as the march is concerned, if had participated in a march I would know exactly why I’m participating, I wouldn’t need to ask the Secreary General or President. I know the ESTU was asked to participate but the members there had no clue what it was all about as no one could explain it to them, especially the President of the BPSU.

    As far as the non-participation of the BIU, the march was organised by the Bermuda Trade Union Congress and the BIU is not a part of that organisation. You can ask you General Secretary or President why that is so.

    On another note, you stated “the BIU leadership being percieved as very close to the PLP”. I wonder why you consider that a problem when history has recorded that the PLP was formed as the political arm of the BIU. Just in case you forgot, Ottiwell Simmons, a former President of the BIU was a PLP Member of Parliament. Derrick Burgess, another former President of the BIU is also a PLP Member of Parliament. The present President, Chris Furbert, was a candidate for the PLP and George Scott, the Chief Organiser was a PLP Member of Parliament and Calvin Smith, the Research Office for the BIU was also a PLP Member of Parliament and was appointed to the Senate by the PLP. So what is wrong with the leadership of the BIU being close to the PLP?

  27. Um, LaVerne, when did I say that the close relationship of the BIU to the PLP was a problem? All I did say was that the dockworkers I spoke to thought that was the reason they weren’t contacted – that information would be leaked. I personally disputed that, as there are plenty of Party members within all of the unions involved. I suggest you reread and reflect as opposed to react.

    I will not rule out the possibility of some future time where the family relationship between you and Vanz would necessarily be required. Like this post right now. Don’t know what other situations would be, but I’m not ruling out the possibility.

    You know what? That we fought tooth and nail against unionisation? Really? Since when where you privy to the meetings of the Workers Council? Since when did you come and speak to our workers without prejudging them? We did not fight tooth and nail against unionisation, we fought against being forced into a union against our will for the very reason that the ability of a government to force workers into a union would also allow the reverse, to force workers out of a union, and that was not a precedent we would allow. So you say you know what happened all the way from your office in town? Do tell. Your account so far comes across as the one far from reality. And do you honestly not percieve how patronising you sound “Again, speak to those with some authority and find out the truth of the matter.” Perhaps you should do the same before you write more articles in the Workers Voice concerning us WITHOUT EVEN INTERVIEWING ONE BAMZ WORKER!

    Even still, you have not answered the question of why you felt it necessary to bring up the issue of the Aquarium and its unionisation.

    I understand that the reason the BIU has so far elected not to join the BTUC is related to the issue of the 35hour week. I support the granting of the 35 hour week for all workers, and will argue that within the BPSU, but so far it has not come up to date. Perhaps you would be so willing as to give us an account yourself. You obviously seem to know the reason, so I’ll take your advice and ask ‘for the truth of the matter’ as you understand it on that one.

    I know perfectly well why I marched. My reasons are all over this blog. Perhaps you should reread them. I saw no reason in spelling it out again, especially seeing as the comments of the union leaders are there for all to see. Also, there was a division from the BIU present. So why were they there then? Did they not know why they were there then?

  28. again – js i think u have a good heart – but ur thanking and defending bdasux but clashing with sister furbert – makes no sense – either u believe in solidarity or u don’t – from ur actions u seem to believe that bda sux has the best interest of bda workers at heart but sister furbert doesn’t – all to the glee of the haterz –

    u need to ask urself why ur are qwik to anger over sister furbert’s challenges yet sit idly by while loki et al spew venom – u abnd i had a difference of opinion because of how i posted on certain sites – sister furbert seems to be posting in the manner that u suggested i do – yet u still haver a problem

    it’s sad – but the big picture ur giving is that u’ll give bda sux the benefit of the doubt but question the BIU.

    and c’mon – u know why the bpsu is angry w/ the plp and it has nothing to do with the workers – it has to do with someones’ ego at the bpsu – either u knwo this and are being disengenuous or don’t and are being misled.

    question: do u put much stock into the opinion of labour lions like ottie, ira phillips cal smith etc. – or are u good with ur pov.

    if u r good luck js – sounds like u have all the answers.

  29. “and c’mon – u know why the bpsu is angry w/ the plp and it has nothing to do with the workers – it has to do with someones’ ego at the bpsu – either u knwo this and are being disengenuous or don’t and are being misled.”

    Care to elaborate as to how you would know this? Have you talked to the person whose ego you are questioning? Do you know this via some form of telepathy? Or are you just insinuating opinion as fact?

    LaVerne’s issue here when questioning Starling is that she is attempting to place herself, a person outside the discussions at BAMZ, as some in a greater position of knowledge about the goings on there than someone who was actually deeply involved in the process. Again, he points out that she writes articles concerning what’s going on over at the BAMZ all without first consulting the actual people who work there.

    Starling’s thanking of people’s well wishes over at BDA Sucks has nothing to do with his reaction to LaVerne’s line of questioning and method of insinuation. Again I would tend to agree with him that you are taking the opinions of some over there and using them to type-case every thing that goes on over there.

    As to you comment that he sits idly by while other posters “spit venom”, I think you really to go back and see how he has reacted to the last couple of posts by people like De Onion.

  30. Vanz,

    I do not see myself as ‘clashing’ with LaVerne. She has posted on my site. She posed certain questions. I have answered them, and replied in kind. This site is for frank and open discussion; as far as I’m concerned that is what I am doing with the ongoing discussion with LaVerne. I take issue with her, she takes issue with me, but ultimately the discourse advances. Its that simple.

    As for what Loki had posted, I found it unneccessary. You may notice that I am trying very hard to walk a fine line in moderating this blog. Some things I let slide. Its kind of like a football game, I caution some things, give a yellow card on others, etc. It depends on how serious an offence it is. I think Loki was wrong in what he wrote, but I have no intention to litter this blog with numerous words of caution – it really does affect the tempo of discourse when one does that.

    I am not necessaarily in ‘anger’ with LaVerne, although it certainly seems she is angry with me.

    I have defended thanking a post on Bda Sucks that was in solidarity with the demo. Get a grip man. That hardly condones solidarity with everything that has been posted on that site.

    Didn’t realise I was questioning the BIU at all. I questioned LaVerne. She may be connected to the BIU, but I hardly see her as representative of either the BIU or the PLP. Perhaps you should reread what was written?

    I am suprised that you would attempt to belittle the demonstration as being nothing more than ‘has to do with someones’ ego at the bpsu.’ No doubt this charge will be blasted at the BIU next time it goes on strike with that line of thought. I realise you are off-island, so all I can reply to you on that really is that either you are being ‘disingenious’ or you are ‘being misled.’

    You honestly think five thousand workers were misled into a demonstration of solidarity with a march on Parliament because of the ego of someone at the BPSU? What brave new double think is this?

    I have a healthy respect for those ‘labour lions’ you speak off, and have more in common with them ideologically than not. But do I always agree with them? Heck no. I have my own mind with which to critically think and reach conclusions with, and do not exist in some sort of hive mentality like some in the Party would like.

    I do not claim to have all the answers friend. I claim to have the ability to think independently and critically, and to disagree with friends and to engage in rational discourse. I have asked LaVerne, and yourself, some questions, so obviously I don’t claim to have all the answers. Its actually you and LaVerne who better fit that description as your vague comments above would indicate.

    Finally, I want to stress once more that I welcome and value your input, as I do others like LaVerne and Ken and such. The fact that I dedicate such energy to discuss these matters with you is more a mark of respect with you than it is an attack on you. The largest arguments I have are with those I am close to; I don’t have huge arguments with those I am not so close to. Hope that makes sense.

  31. Jonathan, as I have said time and time again, there are some things that you think you know, but you really don’t know. Once again I ask you to check out why the BAMZ did not become a member of the BIU when all other government workers did way back when. This happened long before you became an employee of the Ministry of the Environment. This no something that just happened in the last ten years. The BIU has had an agency shop agreement with the Bermuda Government for well over 20 years, or probably 30 years, long before the PLP became the Government. I don’t know of any other Government department where industrial “blue collar” workers are members of the BPSU and not the BIU. Do you know of any, if so pray tell. All of the workers at the BAMZ are not scientists. I am sorry if you feel that I am sounding patronising, but I do know that some things happened at the BAMZ before you became employed there. That is why I am suggesting that you find out the truth. By the way, I don’t need to contact anyone that works at the BAMZ to find out why they refused to become members of the BIU, I have read the actual records.

    Secondly the issue with the BIU and the TUC has nothing to do with the 35 hour work week. Of course the dockworkers or any other division of the BIU was not contacted by the BIU Executive to participate in the “demonstration”. That’s because the demonstration involved members of the TUC and the BIU is not a part of that.

    THe only time I expect you to say anything of my relationship with Vanz is if you’re writing my obituary of his, there would be no other reason for you to refer to our relationship on this website.

    You are quite correct, your reasons for marching are all over this website and on the front page of the Royal Gazette. I was asking why the BPSU marched, as you seem to be speaking with some authority on behalf of the BPSU. As I have read here on your blog which has been copied by the Royal Gazette you have stated “If they (the Government,I guess that who you mean, they (the Government) will get one. We (the BPSU, I guess that’s who you mean)are ready for it, and we (the BPSU) have the support of the people(I guess you’re talking about me and the rest of Bermuda here).

    As far as being angry with you, that is neithere here or there. For your information, there are many people angry with you, who do not read you blog but who have read the Royal Gazette today. It is their right to be angry with you just as it is your right to be angry with the Government and express your anger publicly. However, there are those of us who are members of the Bermuda Progressive Labour Party who believe that our dissatisfaction with the Party should be expressed within the Party. You don’t subscribe to that school of thought, and that is your right.

    As far as the BIU division that was there at the demonstration, that will be dealt with internally as it should be.

    Lastly, you should understand that the PLP is not a Marxist Party, neither is it a socialist party and in my opinion it will never be either. As I see it, the PLP is now and always has been and always will be a party that represents the workers of Bermuda, whether they be doctors, lawyers, dockworkers, bus drivers, taxi drivers, school teachers, secretaries, etc. etc. etc. Those are the people who make up the membership of the PLP. Some are unionised and others are not. Just as the founding fathers of the PLP had varied careers (lawyer, mechanic, school teacher, etc. etc.) so the memership remains today.

    Whether you want to believe it or not, Dr. Brown worked hard to get where he is today, as Lois Browne-Evans worked to get where she got and Freddie Wade worked to get where he got. They were all workers!!

  32. One more thing Jonathan, what you read about in books, I have lived. Tell me this, why was yesterday “a momentous day in the history of labour relations in Bermuda” and the 1981 strike was a horror story to the Royal Gazette? Think on that!! Why was yesterday a momentous day in history, but yet with the Marine & Ports Division came out in solidarity a couple of months ago it was a horror story in the Royal Gazette. Why was yesterday a momentous day in history when, according to the Royal Gazette 5000 workers downed tools, but yet when the BIU called a general membership meeting the other day that same newspaper was complaining about the inconvience it caused the country?
    Something is wrong with that picture!!

  33. “I think Loki was wrong in what he wrote”

    Why? It was 100% accurate, and demonstrated the sheer, unadulterated hypocrisy of an individual who seemed personally slighted by – shock! Horror! – the revelation that she is the mother of Vance Chapman, when her own behaviour has been both malicious and far more sinister.

  34. It is 0200hrs Sunday morning. I’m not sure if I’ll have time to respond to all of this properly until I get to where I’m travelling to. I will reply to all of your points when I can.

    Thankyou for your comments.

  35. Laverne, you seem to be confusing the Royal Gazette’s editorial stance with Jonathon’s personal views. It’s an easy straw man for you to tear apart I know, but why don’t you “Think on that!!” They’re an easy foil for you I know, but The Royal Gazette and Jonathon are not one in the same as you know.

  36. “Lastly, you should understand that the PLP is not a Marxist Party, neither is it a socialist party and in my opinion it will never be either. As I see it, the PLP is now and always has been and always will be a party that represents the workers of Bermuda”….et al.

    Would someone care to try and explain where the PLP does sit in terms of it’s politics?

    Clearly not far left – not even left. Middle ground perhaps? Of late it could be argued that it’s approach has been Thatcherite.

  37. Hi Loki, I was referring solely to the second comment of yours “**waits for pathetic, but inevitable ‘racist pig’/’cracker’ insult** – it was unnecessary. Thats all.

  38. I’m in a rush so I’ll try to make this brief:

    LaVerne, You have yet to explain why you felt it neccessary to bring up my place of work, or how that whole issue on unionisation is/was relevant. And why seek to discuss it here rather than on the thread dedicated to it in my reply to you is also beyond me. I’ll attempt to reply to your comments here on that post for now on.

    You write that I seem to speaking with ‘some authority for the BPSU’ based on my comments that the RG lifted from this thread. Thats a stunning feat of illogic there. My account was based on an eye-witness report of the demo and the sentiments that were expressed by the participants. Many people felt that Dr. Brown was being disrespectful. They said so. That is a fact. I am little more than a messenger in that respect. How you jump from that to me speaking with authority for the BPSU is beyond me. The sentiment of the people was that we are ready for a general strike. Perhaps you are suprised that individual members of organisations are capable of independent thought and statements?

    Your reaction on the whole issue of ever being noted as the mother of Vanz is suprising. Had I been saying something negative there it would at least be understandable. I have said that I will not refer to it except when it is unavoidable – as in the very discussion of it like now. That is all I can offer. Should I need to write about, say, hypothetically, a certain member of the Party intervening and undermining the constitutional autonomy of the youth wing by overruling its autonomous decisions as per its autonomous blog because said Party member was acting for that persons son, then it becomes relevant. Thats hypothetical. But thats an example were the relationship would be relevant. You know, any conflicts of interest or something like that. Its that simple.

    I certainly hope I am not going to be writing anyones obituary any time soon though.

    As for you being angry, I could hardly care about that at all. Likewise if other members of the Party are angry with me. If they want they can make a motion for my being disciplined or even expelled. I’ld be happy to defend myself both in public and within the Party. I think you’ll find that a greater number of Party members are angry with the Party Leadership than they are angry with me for calling it as I see it.

    I have written elsewhere, in fact in a reply to you, that the Party machinery is defunct. I have written about the CC. I bet you at least an equal number of Party members read this blog as attend any Central Committee meeting. My thoughts here are they same I express in CC, I see no difference and have no problem defending myself here or there. Here at least we can show the vibrant democratic spirit our Party supposedly embraces. Technology has changed. ITs up to the Party to adapt to that fact.

    Also in my reply to your ‘suggestion’ that I reasses my reasons for joining the PLP, that you are conveniently ignoring, I mad eit clear that I do not see the Party as socialist or Marxist. I sugget you reread what I wrote. I do wonder though if you could explain what you think the PLP is though? What political ideology does it represent? Or is it nothing more than a form of friendly society like the freemasons? I truly would liek to hear your thoughts on that, as that is quite an important subject.

    I’m sure Dr. Brown and others have worked hard to get where they are today. Great! What does that have to do with anything? No one questioned that. I question the direction of the Party, not Dr. Brown.

    Fine, you have’ lived the history.’ Great. I’m ‘livinig’ the creation of new history. The movement has not ossified even if some of its leaders and mouthpieces have.

    The demo was nowhere near the level that the 1981 General Strike was. No where have I indicated that. What was historic though were the circumstances and the actions of the Police. I know as well as you do that the media has its own political agenda. you know as well as I that I do not share their agenda, not by a long shot. While they may think it is to their vested interests advantage to use the writing of a Marxist to attack the Party they are playing a dangerous game. The libertarian Marxism I represent poses a much greater threat to their interests than the banality of the current dominant ideology. They are simply helping their own grave-digger in the long run as far as I’m concerned. And while more Party members no doubt read the RG than this blog, I can assure you that you are seriously underestimating how many Party members do actually read this blog.

  39. Dear Sir:

    “We see the essential mission of the […………] Party to be the empowerment of the broad majority of the Bermudian people. We see a New Bermuda, in which the talents of every Bermudian will be mobilized in building a humane society, in which social and economic justice is a reality, not just an ideal.
    The [……] Party’s policies and programmes are meant to rekindle hope, to heal Bermuda ‘s present divisions and to replace apathy and alienation with a spirit of optimism and a feeling of oneness and unity. We continue to put Bermuda first, and to put Bermudians first.”

    Rumour has it that these are the noble and inspired words that form the mission statement of a certain political party. You would be forgiven for failing to recognize exactly which political party this noble “mission” should be attributed to, but apparently it is the so-called Progressive Labour Party that claims such a mission statement- a party that prides itself on forming Bermuda’s first so-called “labour government”.

    Before you form any judgments about who is writing this, let me just say a few words about who I am. I am not in politics nor do I have any desire to be at this time. I have no axe to grind with any politician or political party, and although I am a son of the soil, I am not THE infamous “Son of the Soil”. I am a young black man who has spent most of his adult life voting for the PLP. I am one of those voters who on the 9th November 1998 celebrated what I thought was the birth of a true democratic process where finally voters could express confidence in a new political party taking the reigns of power and relegate the arrogant and complacent incumbent to the Opposition. I celebrated what I thought would be the dawn of a new age, not where manna would fall from the sky, but where finally, as the mission statement above states, there would be an empowerment of the “broad majority of the Bermudian people”. As a labour government one takes this to mean, not just black people, but anyone, black, Anglo or Portuguese, who has previously been disenfranchised or marginalized in this economy. I am talking about those of us who were not able to get a good job in top local companies by virtue of being fortunate enough to have a daddy or uncle in a senior and influential position to do our bidding for us. I refer to those who were never able to make an impact in the international business world because of cultural bias, despite the fact that we were qualified and worked hard. I refer to those local ambitious entrepreneurs who always seemed to fall short of the criteria required to win a major government contract. I refer to the unions, (oh yes remember them?) who for so long pined for the day when they would actually have a labour government in power who would understand and address their needs with at least some degree of empathy.

    I recognize and appreciate that the PLP has done some good things over the last ten years, but it would be an understatement to say that I have been disappointed with the extent to which this government has squandered the goodwill and momentum that it was bestowed with after the 1998 election. In fact, my disappointment has rapidly evolved into disgust over the last eighteen months as I have witnessed the exponential deterioration of the moral fiber and integrity of the government under the current leadership of Premier, Dr Ewart Brown.

    Premier Brown came into power on a wave of euphoria. There were many who doubted his integrity and were wary of what they saw as an overbearing ego and naked ambition. However, there were many more who felt that as premier, in spite of, or perhaps because of his head strong disposition, and because of his talents he would rise to the occasion to achieve a level of excellence for the country. If the country did well, he would look good. There were many who saw him as Bermuda ‘s version of “New Labour” where the old core principles of the party would be given a modern finish, where he could straddle from negotiating and conversing with CEOs of exempt companies to union bosses. Unfortunately, it would appear that the lure of power and prestige has had such an intoxicating effect on his leadership that you really cannot even call it “leadership”.

    It is hard to know where to begin in this regard. There have been accusations of corruption, stealing cedar beams (good one), taking kick backs on government consultancy contracts and handing out lucrative perks to friends and family. We have even had numerous people arrested, not on charges of corruption, but for going out of their way to inform the public of such allegations of corruption. But let me say it is not my intent to accuse anyone of corruption. However, what I would ask anyone to do is to read that mission statement above, in the context of this being a “labour” government, and ask yourself if this government, under this current leadership, remotely resembles what it has set out to do. Ask yourself if this government has kept in line with the core principles upon which the party was founded and made a genuine attempt to empower the disenfranchised.

    It is difficult to drive two miles without almost being run off the road by some massive construction trucks which invariably have the names “Island Construction” or “Correira Construction” emblazoned on the side. In every parish you will come across multiple government construction sites that will proudly display the logo of one of these two companies. So let me ask, how much money has government spent paying these two non-unionized Portuguese construction companies on government contracts over the last four years? Exactly where is the money going? Exactly who is getting paid what? What is the infatuation with these two construction companies? Is it just a coincidence we now have Zane DeSilva as an MP? Was it a coincidence that Dennis Correira’s wife is now so involved in the party? Exactly who is being empowered?

    The PLP government was very vocal in stating their belief that Jim Butterfield and his crew should not have their lease renewed at the Bermuda Cement Co Ltd, as they felt that the old white families of Bermuda has had their time. They ousted Mr. Butterfield from his position in the most unethical manner only to replace old white money with new white money. What exactly was the point of this exercise?

    Whilst in the Opposition the PLP complained bitterly that the UBP were not doing enough to empower Bermudians in the work force. Under this government we have record numbers of expats who are given work permits. Yes, of course we need expats particularly in the area of reinsurance. However, there are many hard-working, well educated Bermudians who continue to feel as though they are not getting a fair deal in the industry. Whilst companies like to give out scholarships to young Bermudians and hire them at entry level underwriting positions the number of Bermudians in decision-making positions within the reinsurance are few and far between. There is still a perception that cultural bias plays a significant part in determining who gets elevated up the ranks in companies. We have some very bright and qualified expats in this country. However, we still have far too many who come here with no special qualifications, who get trained on the job, and are given great exposure on the job, and before you know it they are CFO, SVP or General Counsel. Meanwhile the Bermudian is told he needs more experience or is overqualified. Far too many hard-working, qualified Bermudians are forced to sit back and watch as others enjoy going from middle-class to millionaire in this country, literally overnight. This government has done nothing to address this problem. In fact it is now worse than it was under the UBP. It would appear that so long as exempt company executives buy a $25,000 plate to one of our Premier’s tourism dinners and give a little money to the odd charity then they can have what ever their hearts desire. “Good Corporate Citizenship” is a toothless joke.

    Whilst our trade unions are embroiled in a bitter dispute with government to gain the most modest of increases simply to keep pace with the cost of living, our Premier – our labour Premier – is travelling to Washington on a private jet at tax payers’ expense to go and meet one of the most unpopular presidents in the history of the United States to spend twenty minutes talking about significant world issues like, how well Barbara Bush’s knee operation went, and how the weather was in Bermuda. Given that this President will be on his way out in November would it not have made more sense to wait until the new president comes into office and spend tax payers’ money on that trip? What is the point of solidifying a relationship with an outgoing president? Or perhaps our Premier is unsure if he will be around after November, and a last photo opportunity was too good an opportunity to miss, particularly since Tiger Woods will not be coming this year. Right now you have all the trade unions in Bermuda contemplating strike action and our Premier is more concerned about shaking hands and getting his photo taken in Washington . How many more times must we be subjected to another ridiculous photo of our Premier in the newspaper smiling up against some celebrity or politician he has managed to convince to take a photo with him? The question remains, where is the priority for this government?

    Ask yourself how much this government is spending on overseas consultants? Why isn’t there a list of all consultants that government has on their tab and how much each one is being paid? Who are these people? What is their experience? What is their relationship to members of the cabinet? Are there any conflicts of interest? What is the vetting process which determines who gets what contract? Who has the final say? What exactly have these consultants achieved? I would hate to think that anyone is getting any kick-backs.

    Why do we have the Premier’s half brother, Mr. Philip Butterfield, HSBC’s newest Country Manager (yes, that is the official title) being made chairman of every doggone board in this country? Why do we have members of HSBC coming into the schools to oversee teachers? Do teachers now get to go to HSBC to oversee the bankers? Why does the Premier’s half brother think that he can lecture to Bermuda about education when he cannot even run his own bank efficiently? Education is about creating leaders. Where is the leadership in the management at HSBC? Why are Bermudian professionals at the bank continually complaining that the bank continues to promote foreigners ahead of locals? Why are so many Bermudians leaving, even willing to give up the mortgage subsidy? Perhaps the Premier can direct Rolfe Commissiong to put this topic on the agenda at his next Big Conversation meeting.

    As disappointed as I am with the leadership I am more disappointed with those politicians who surround the leader. It is their silence that speaks greater volumes of the moral bankruptcy of the collective leadership. There is a recurring theme with the PLP cabinet members. They remain silent when their voices are most needed to be heard. This is why the PLP has a leadership crisis every three years. When their leader strays from the right path is when they must act. If the leader is too autocratic or lacks integrity and they disagree with his decision then either speak up or resign from cabinet as anyone with an ounce of integrity would do. Instead they remain silent, and only choose to speak up when the deeds have been done and the horse has bolted from the stable. Sadly, there are still some who continue to sit by quietly in cabinet without taking a stance. It is not enough that you are pleasant and you speak eloquently. If you want to be a future leader you must take a stance!! With the silence of the cabinet ministers one is inclined to wonder just how many of them are part-taking in this free for all. How many of them are happy to unethically take crumbs from off the people’s table?

    As for the voters I do not know what to say. Winston Churchill once said that “the best argument against democracy is a five minute conversation with the average voter.” I do not mean to be disparaging to the average voter but I do believe that in this very materialistic society we live in, we as voters have our priorities in the wrong place. In the very week that our Premier was making a mockery of the democratic process in the House of Assembly by trying to stifle debate with the Opposition about the Cocoa Reef fiasco, more people seemed upset about the fact that tickets to see Beyonce at the Music Festival had sold out. As a people we need to hold our leaders accountable. In Washington , they say that whenever a President has low ratings they find an excuse to engage in some military battle with some other nation. In Bermuda, our Premier’s mode of operation in such situations is to make announcements such as, “I’m happy to tell everyone that Tiger Woods will be coming to Bermuda , or Beyonce, or Alicia Keys.”

    When will our Premier host a press conference and state: “I am proud to announce that we have solved the housing crisis. I am proud to announce that we have solved the education crisis. I am proud to announce that we have cracked crime. I am proud to announce that there is now a significant influx of qualified Bermudians in management and executive positions in international business. I am proud to announce that we have negotiated a proper settlement with the trade unions that will benefit Bermuda . I am proud to announce that we have made significant strides in leveling out the economic playing field by empowering entrepreneurs in this country beyond just friends and family”? There are many who continue to “comfort” themselves by the fact that at least the UBP is no longer in power. Even if you are the staunchest supporter of your party you must still hold your leaders accountable. To question your leaders is not akin to “selling out”. It merely shows you actually have a brain. It is important you ensure that your leaders are not the ones selling YOU out.

    In summary, I will say that this government has failed to live up to its own mission statement. If it were that the government made a genuine attempt to fulfill such a noble mission I would at least salute its efforts and its intent. However, under this leadership, I do not even believe there is any real desire to benefit the country as a whole. This Premier told us that a vote for the UBP would be a “vote to return to the plantation”. Well ask yourself, which plantation are you on and who exactly are the plantation owners? This Premier illegitimately rides on the backs of great leaders of the past who have worked hard to end segregation and bring about genuine empowerment for all disenfranchised persons of this country. He speaks as a though he were a labour leader but his actions are those of an elitist, as aptly described by Bermudian economist, Craig Simmons. The old boys’ network is being replaced by an amateur crew of wannabes whose priority seems to be to get rich as quickly as possible, even at the expense of the middle-class and poor people in this country. The old forty-thieves are being replaced with three or four cat burglars. This Premier preaches “black empowerment” but he spends his weekends playing golf at Tuckers Point and Mid-Ocean with people who don’t look like me. This has become the “Ewart Brown Show” and we are all relegated to being spectators and pawns as he enjoys his big moment in the sun. Open discussion and debate is replaced with secrecy and a lack of transparency and a lack of consultation with the public on major decisions. Whereas in the past the press could rightly be blamed for its racist spin on the news of the day, this government openly boasts of its tactless and tacky indiscretions ( Playboy Mansion comes to mind), and its irresponsible government spending. Does the Ministry of Finance have a say in this?

    Most importantly, this government, under its present leadership is rapidly losing the respect of a significant portion of its core supporters. It has arrogantly disregarded its trade union grassroots base. One would have never foreseen that under this government we would be witnessing one of the biggest union gatherings in twenty years where all the unions, including the police (who I have NEVER seen march before), are marching on Parliament to protest government’s rejection of a binding arbitration award.

    Whilst this government fights tooth and nail against the awarding of a mere 1% increase, it can afford to fly cabinet ministers around the world on private jets. It can afford to rack up a travel bill that could probably feed a small nation (even Bermuda ). It can afford to arm our Premier with a round the clock SWAT team of security to protect him at such dangerous events as the Senior Citizens’ Tea Party and his Gala Weekend Party at the Fairmont. It can afford to buy this Premier a new state of the art BMW. (What exactly happened to the old one? Perhaps the former BIU Leader and now Minister can enlighten us). It can afford to hire these mysterious consultants at outrageous fees to do what many Bermudians are already capable of doing. It can afford to spend money on our Premier’s son’s charity events at the house of a porno king. It can afford to send money to our Premier’s wife’s friends to sponsor their charity. It can afford to spend half a million dollars to host a party at a baseball stadium for guests of the Premier. Yet, this government cannot afford to give the respect to the workers of this country who have formed the very foundation upon which this country, and indeed their own Party, was founded.

    To add insult to injury, the Premier did not even show up to the march on Parliament. Our premier did not even have the moral courage to come out and address the workers. He did not even have the guts to look the workers in the eye and give them at least the respect of an acknowledgment of their concerns. How disgraceful. It is one thing that the Premier conveniently stays out of the country for the Queen’s Birthday parade. However, he shows his true colours when he fails to turn up for such an important labour march. What I can guarantee is that if Beyonce, or Alicia Keyes, or Tiger Woods or some other celebrity had been at the event our beloved Premier would have been there with his press secretary by his side ensuring that he gets photographed with is standard grin and handshake pose. To ensure his arrival, perhaps the unions should organize to get a celebrity at the next march.

    I am inclined to say that we need to take the “P” and the “L” out of PLP. There is nothing “Progressive” about it and it dare not have the audacity to associate itself with “Labour”. The last “P” should remain, because the only thing this government under this leadership is good at doing is hosting a party. I will give them that.

    This government under its present leadership has arrogantly disregarded and even discarded those who have been on the intellectual battle field in defense of this party and this government against those who preached the racist notion that black people cannot and should not lead this country. These “warriors” have not always been in the front line or out in the open. Sometimes the battle takes place at dinner parties at friends’ houses, or at work around the water cooler, on website blogs or just chatting with people on the street. Many of us held high hopes of there being a movement in Bermuda where empowerment would take place, not at the expense of whites, but to give us economic parity with whites by creating a fair and level playing field, so that everyone, regardless of colour or ethnicity can benefit. How many of us sit and watch with envy that the United States is blessed with a candidate like Barack Obama whilst we are left with a self-centered despot surrounded by myopic stooges?

    There will always be those who will blindly support whatever leader is in power (as also used to happen with the UBP). There will be those who continue to write letters to the editor defending anything the Premier and this PLP government does. They will probably label me as another “hater”. There will always be some who will shout with glee and wave their green PLP flag in the air after every PLP victory despite the fact that they cannot afford a house, their children are being taught in schools that are not given the proper tools to deal with social issues, crime in their neighbourhood is on the up, and their county is being sold out to foreign entities at an alarming rate. I am not trying to convert them. I am not even trying to convert our leader. In a few months time he may be ousted or even leave on his own terms, and will likely be on the next plane down to Turks & Caicos to spend more time with his good friend and mentor, Premier Misick. However, there is a growing number who are slowly seeing the writing on the wall and beginning to look beneath the glossy veneer and the emotive rhetoric to see that all that glitters is not gold. Empty words are not enough. Glitz and glamour and gala events are fun but they are not the foundation upon which a nation is built. It is time that Bermudians stand up for themselves and hold their leaders accountable. A fish rots from the head down and when the head exudes a lack of ethics, morals, Godliness and respect for fellow man, then the body too will rot. Perhaps the drum beat that reverberates around Hamilton today will wake up those who continue to slumber through the storm.

    Drummer Boy

  40. “Hi Loki, I was referring solely to the second comment of yours “**waits for pathetic, but inevitable ‘racist pig’/’cracker’ insult** – it was unnecessary. Thats all.”

    Ah, yes. That was aimed at Vance, rather than LaVerne, and is in keeping with his racist Bermuda Sucks postings. I’m happy to confirm that I’ve never seen LaVerne write any such thing.

  41. Absolutely brilliant, Drummer Boy. Right up there with Jon Starling and Denis Pitcher for clarity and purpose. You should start a blog.

    Sadly, I don’t think it will change any minds, no matter how right you are.

  42. Well I got my reply from the IWW about the march, and so now I can officially say that all of us, from Bermuda to the United States to Canada, to England, to Scotland, to Germany, to Japan and everywhere in between where there is an Industrial Worker of the World, we stand in solidarity with you.

    Also there will be a write up about the march in our bi-monthly paper, the Industrial Worker, for the July/August issue.

    In Solidarity

  43. I guess I might as well whistle for my supper – but it would be ‘helpful’ if someone associated with the PLP would at least attempt a response to Drummer Boy’s piece.

  44. Drummer Boy may not be THE SON OF THE SOIL, but he’s got the same issues, uses the same vernacular and has the same issues that the Son of the Soil had/has. Maybe he’s the Son of the Soil’s surrogate son. But like the Son of the Soil and the rest of us, he’s entitled to his opinion and he’s entitled to share it with as many people as he deems necessary.

    LaVerne Furbert

  45. Ms. Furbert,

    I was just wondering what your veiws are on the march last Friday? Doesn’t approximately 5,000 workers show that there is some discontent among the population with the current leadership. By disregarding them (silence on a subject is the same), you are in essence stating that their feelings of being “short changed” are null and void. The fact of the matter is it wasn’t just the RG or a bunch of “angry white people” as yuor son, or Vanz i should say, phrased it on other sites, that are complaing about the infalliable EB. Or are these just a whole bunch of “confused negroes” that don’t know what they are marching for?

  46. Sorry, should have put a footnote of the quote “confused negroes” as being attributed to your election speech/rant.

  47. 9Ps,

    Before I respond to your question, can you tell me your mother’s name? As you’re making refernce to my son, I should reference your mother in my response. Did you not read what I said to Jonathan about referring to my familial relationships?

  48. “Drummer Boy may not be THE SON OF THE SOIL, but he’s got the same issues, uses the same vernacular and has the same issues that the Son of the Soil had/has. Maybe he’s the Son of the Soil’s surrogate son.”

    I thought we weren’t allowed to discuss family relationships on this blog! lol

  49. “Did you not read what I said to Jonathan about referring to my familial relationships?”

    I’ll go out on a limb here and suggest that he was, quite rightly, ignoring such a ridiculously hypocritical non-point. To summarize, then:

    1. Publicly threatening an ex-pat blogger with regard to his work permit and discussing his wife’s place of work = just fine and dandy; and

    2. Publicly stating that LaVerne Furbert is Vance Chapman’s mother, which is well-known, anyway = a shocking lack of courtesy and an appalling slight.

    Glad we clarified that.

  50. Ms. Furbert,

    As a young member of the PLP, I can assure you that Drummer Boy’s opinion (for the most part) is shared by many of us. Unfortunately it appears you are missing the most important thing. Dr. Brown is not PLP, he is a MEMBER of PLP, just like you or I. He works for us, and thusly, we are more than entitled to give him a performance review which, judging by the the “Board Meeting” held on Friday, he has failed.

    People are upset, people are angry. How can all this just be discounted as sour grapes? We believe in PLP, we support PLP but does the PLP leadership believe in us?

    Alsys

  51. Funny how that works huh Ms. Furbert? You know that post just above this one pointing out your double standards and your obvious disdain for the democratic right of free speech.

    So please, do you consider the mass movement of Unionised workers who marched on cabinet a bunch of “angry white people” and “confused negroes?

  52. Ms. Furbert give it up. EB is a complete joke. The best thing for the PLP to do is to get rid of the guy and let him be on his way out of here. I’m confident that once he isn’t Premier anymore he’ll be outta here on the first flight! You know, so he can play around in his fancy boat, hang out at the Playboy mansion, and eat and indulge in the finest wines with his elitist buddies. I’ll be happy for him knowing it’s not coming out of my taxes.
    Take your face out of that ‘economic pie’ and realise he has to go for the sake of this country! But family doesn’t do that to family does it?

  53. Before I respond to your question, can you tell me your mother’s name? As you’re making refernce to my son, I should reference your mother in my response. Did you not read what I said to Jonathan about referring to my familial relationships?

    Just curious Mrs. Furbert … how does your request/preference to withhold identifying personal relationships/information reconcile with your wilful disclosure of Mr. Wells’ familial relationships on his blog, A Limey In Bermuda?

  54. I’d like to know who appointed Ms. Furbert as the PLP’s external party whip? Since when do political parties publicly castigate individual followers to be quiet (or is this really just a personal animosity that has spilled over)? Excess like this merely discredits Ms. Furbert. Jonathan, are you sure we can’t blame her posting on the UBP?

  55. Drummer Boy has captured my thoughts in a succinct and impressive manner.

    I am not at all surprised that Ms Furbert has issues with the his commentary, given her need to be seen to be loyal to the one person that validates her existence. Every would be dictator requires needy and trusted lieutenants.

    Long live true democracy!!!!

  56. Bermuda Sucks has now moved to “Catch A Fire”!! I’m really not sure if I want to enter a dialogue wtih you all, but I’ll give it a try. Let me start here, I have two sons, Vance and David Chapman and I can assure you that I’m extremely proud of both of them. They’re both very intelligent men who are excelling in the chosen careers. In fact I constantly get compliments about both of my sons from those in this community who know me and know them.

    Secondly, I don’t agree with most of the things that Drummer Boy has written. His experience with the PLP and Dr. Brown is unlike mine and unlike that of a lot of other PLP members and supporters. But as I said he is entitled to his opinion.

    Alys, Dr. Brown is not like you (whoever you are) and I. Dr. Brown was elected as the Leader of the PLP. If you are a member of the PLP (as you say, but I have no proof as you choose to remain anonymous) and you want Dr. Brown to be removed as the Leader, you can participate in that process the next time there is a leadership contest. Certainly you can give him a performance review and I would suggest that you share your concerns at your next Branch meeting, or maybe you would want to attend the next Central Committee meeting. If you’re a member, you have the right to attend and voice your concerns. If you are indeed a member of the PLP and have attended Central Committee meetings you would know that just as I voice my opinion publicly, I do so there. If you were indeed a member of the Party you would know that my opinion is not always in sync the leadership and I have no fear of letting my feelings be known.

    Now let’s talk about the “Board meeting” on Friday. According to the Royal Gazette there were 5,000 Board members in attendance. I can assure you if the same number of people had come out to protest something that the UBP had said or done, the number of Board members would have shrunk to about 2,000. You should remember that over 16,000 people voted for the PLP in the last election. So those “Board members” certainly did not represent a majority of PLP supporters.

    I can tell you though that I’m anxiously awaiting to see how the “Board members” feel when the Government will have to raise taxes so that it can meet their demands for pay increases, etc. But I have no problem with the “Board members” doing what they feel is necessary to get their demands met and I’ve never intimated or voiced that I had a problem with their demonstration.

    Can you show me where I discounted anything as sour grapes? I do agree with you that some people are upset and some people are very angry. Hey, I listen to talks shows and read blogs like this. But there are are 5 people who call the talk shows on a regular basis that are upset and angry and they’re all UBP supporters. There are 10 people that posts regularly on these blogs that are upset and angry and they’re all UBP supporters. There were lots of (other) PLP members and supporters that were upset and angry on Friday as well, but not for the same reasons that you are upset and angry.

    By the way, Alys, when was the last time you (as a PLP member) had a conversation with Dr. Brown or any other Member of Parliament?

    LaVerne Furbert

    P.S. Were you involved in the demonstration on Friday?

  57. By the way, Alys, when was the last time you (as a PLP member) had a conversation with Dr. Brown or any other Member of Parliament?

    Well, I am his constituent and the answer is never. Neither he nor any representative has ever come by.

  58. Like I said in post #45, Drummer Boy’s eloquence has failed to resonate with the party faithful/indoctrinated. Perhaps it is a bit harsh to use “faithful” as there are many fine members like Alsys and Jonathan who have expressed similar statements. So, indoctrinated it should be.

    Perhaps there could actually be discourse if the antagonist would refrain from ad hominem attacks and the usual straw-man arguments. Familial relationships are irrelevant, but threats and baseless accusations are not.

    Actual numbers on Friday was about 2,500-3,000. Still, not insubstantial, and while not the amount that voted for the PLP in the last election, certainly more than the difference between the parties’ totals.

  59. I can tell you though that I’m anxiously awaiting to see how the “Board members” feel when the Government will have to raise taxes so that it can meet their demands for pay increases, etc. But I have no problem with the “Board members” doing what they feel is necessary to get their demands met and I’ve never intimated or voiced that I had a problem with their demonstration.

    How dare you say something like this when the Premier just paid $90,000 for a brand new car. Travel expenses are at a historical high. We’ve paid higher taxes for months now for those free buses and ferries and child care that we haven’t seen. How dare you say raise taxes when the Premier takes $10,000 trips, flies in private jets, has a personal entourage, bodyguards, plays golf at Mid Ocean and Tuckers Point. How dare you!

  60. You know Ms Furbert…it must have taken you all day to craft that response.

    Dodging every bullet…perhaps just throwing a little to the members every so often (“I do agree with you that some people are upset”)…an incredible clairvoyant (“there are 10 people that posts regularly on these blogs that are upset and angry and they’re all UBP supporters”).

    The really funny thing is that you just cannot see that the language that you use is so condescending, in particular to Aslys who I know from blogging over at BDS. Aslys is as straight as they come. Hardworking, doing two jobs and like Drummer Boy, she has a dream that the PLP will make it happen. A dream that was in part realised in 1998, and now….well now she’s no so sure that it’s going to happen.

    Ms Furbert – talk about how to piss off one’s supporters and members…you are turning it into an art form.

  61. Hi Ms. Furbert

    Thanks for reading and responding to my post.

    Firstly, and I think most importantly, by board members I mean those who the government actually WORKS for, not who voted them in. The premier and the government are paid by all bermudians, whether white, black, plp or ubp… and any other catagories. By your statements it is evident that only plp supporters are important and that’s what is so very sad in your point of view. We all live on this island, we all pay taxes and we are ALL affected by what OUR government or does not do.

    As for my anonymity, sadly, too many people know who I am and how I post and my place in plp to be truly anonymous but I’d rather keep that information with those who know me.

    I don’t neceaarily want Dr Brown to be removed as leader. I like him. I’ve had a bit of a convo with him – which I’m sure he would not remember – and I admire him. I would like him to govern our island better. What happened on Friday showed how disenfranchised a large sector of the labour force now is, those the plp is supposed to protect. It’s not so much the arbitration award being rejected, it’s when the government is spending unbudgeted money on bmws and other such unnecessary expenditures, yet the police and teachers are still waiting for a raise…

    I’m a bit confused about one thing, you say my confusion and anger is different to those of others on friday. How can you presume to tell me why I am angry?

    And no, I am not a member of any of the unions. I did watch the march though.

    Oh, and yeah, I speak to MPs quite on a regular. Does that matter? I am a devout PLP supporter, the party – not a person.

  62. Everyone, please be advised that Ms. Furbert does not represent all PLP smembers. She does not represent all black people. She speaks for herself. Believe me when I tell you that there are many PLP members who are NOT at all happy with the Premier.

    Ms. Furbert needs to take her head out of the sand. I would not waste any more effort debating with her. She has become obsolete and irrelevant, even to other PLP members. She does not even entertain any questions about the Premier. Talk about blind loyalty. It amazes me.

  63. Alys,

    I have been involved in Bermuda politics for a long time, so I know that a government, whether UBP or PLP, cannot just “please” its members. That is why I could not understand the “protest” that took place on Friday, and your earlier comments. Can you point out where in my statements that I have said that the PLP Government must just be important to its members. If that was the case, we would not have had the situation that we had on Friday as I do believe that 90% of BPSU members are PLP voters. As far as the police are concerned, that’s a different story as many of them are non-Bermudians and cannot vote.

    How can you be sure that Dr. Brown would not remember his conversation with you? Is it because you’re listening to people who are saying that he is a dictator, a nasty man who stole cedar beams, etc.etc. etc. I usually judge people from how I find them in one-on-one situations with me, not from what I read about them.

    Tell me some of the things that you see that he could do to govern the island better. Those who protested on Friday are not disenfranchised. They have the power of the vote just as you and I do. They can vote in their unions and they can vote in their branches, if they’re plp members, and they can vote in general elections. People who are disenfranchised cannot vote at all, and Bermuda’s history has already recorded that were really people who disenfranchised.

    So you’re saying the PLP Government is spending unbudgeted money on BMSs. Are you saying that the Government should not have purchased a BMW for the Governor when his car was wrecked by his driver? The car that the Government is purchasing for the Premier is the exact same car that the Government purchased for the Governor. Do you think that Sir Richard Gozney should have a better car than the Premier?

    What other unnecessary expenditures are you talking about? Don’t just give me hearsay, just give me facts please.

    I did not say your confusing and anger was different from other people on Friday. What I did say that there were some other people, other than those who participated in the “demonstration” that were also angry that the demonstration took place, as they had some information which you obviously didn’t have. I don’t know what you were/are angry about. As you are not a member of any union, you obviously could not be angry because the Government asked to review the arbitrated awards.

  64. BTW, I was there at the march. There were at least 4000 people there. If you think that there is no doscontent with this premier you are out of your mind!!!! Maybe Ms. Furbert you should’ve been out to tell them all that they are “confused” negroes. I am telling you this as a black person, as a union member and as a PLP voter. No, you can’t blame the media for this one.

  65. Hey PLP Member,

    I’ve been a member of the PLP long enough to know that the membership is never totally in favour of the leader. I came along when Walter Robinson was the leader, some people wanted him gone. They then wanted Lois Browne Evans gone, and then Freddy Wade, then Jennifer Smith, then Alex Scott. I have never seen the membership totally in support of any one leader. Yeah, there’s disconent with Dr. Brown, but I would never consider those people who are discontented with Dr. Brown as confused negroes. That’s not a term I use. And as far as the media is concerned, I’ve never blamed the ignorance of some people on the media.

    By the way, which branch are you associated with?

  66. Ms. Furbert it seems that the only thing you are interested is identifying these anonymous people. May I ask why?
    People don’t need to post their identities. They have real concerns and that is what’s most important.
    Personally I do not reveal my identity out of fear. Yes that’s right, fear. This government is more concerned about shooting the messenger than dealing with the real issues. We have seen people’s work permits revoked and even government ministers being cut because they have spoken out against the government. The government has instilled fear in the population. Sad but true. Not all people sip tea with the Premier like you do and thus can reveal their identities with confidence and without fear.

  67. I’m associated with the branch that wants to give the Premier a good stinging! A good whipping into shape? Do you know that branch Ms. Furbert? Do you?

    And what exactly did you mean when you referred to Drummer Boy as the surrogate son of “son of the Soil”? I know what you meant Ms. Furbert. Keep guessing.

  68. My doctor tells me that my eyes and ears work fine so I think I am capable of answering this one. It looks like Laverne Furbert and she referred to Shawn Crockwell as a confused Negro. Hows that?

  69. “PLP member Says:
    June 30, 2008 at 9:24 pm

    I’m associated with the branch that wants to give the Premier a good stinging! A good whipping into shape? Do you know that branch Ms. Furbert? Do you?”

    stinging, whipping? that’s white boy talk – yeah – ur plp fer sher.

  70. “It looks like Laverne Furbert and she referred to Shawn Crockwell as a confused Negro. Hows that?”

    yeah byes – just cuz he stole smack from the courts and sold it on the streets – thats not a confused negro – that’s actually the calibre of negro that the ubp would run in a safe seat and put in parliament – i’ve often wondered how many AIDS case is UBP mp “non confused negro” crockwell directly responsible for

  71. i know plp insider and i can vouch for his legitimacy – he really is a plp insider – and know all abut what ‘s really going on in the inside of the plp – and he and other “insiders” in that “branch” really exist and will be giving the premier a stinging and whipping soon.

    signed,

    plp insider II

  72. i too am a plp insider and i know plp insider 1 and II and i can vouch for their legitimacy – they really are plp insiders – and they know all abut what’s really going on in the inside of the plp – and they and other “insiders” in that “branch” really exist and will be giving the premier a stinging and whipping soon.

    signed,

    plp insider III

  73. Mr Chapman & Ms Furbert

    You have been given a shovel each. It appears you have both decided to keep on digging rather than put it down and walk away, and you have dug so deep now I am not sure how you can climb out with dignity. Your choice, and JS has given you plenty of opportunities.

    It is often the case that people keep on digging out of fear, and in this case perhaps it is fear that your patron will not be in office in the near future – just a thought.

    Seems like there are a lot of PLP Insiders on this site.

    Pitts Bay

  74. Lavernne Furbert is to the PLP what Bill O’Reilly is to Right Wing America. There is not even a hint of balance to their arguments, which renders them useless as voices of reason..

    I am not suggesting that both she and O’Reilly are not capable individuals, quite the opposite, which makes their biase and myopic reporting, dangerous and unhealthy…

  75. Vanz,

    I wish every person could turn their life around like Shawn Crockwell has done. Doesn’t everyone deserve a second chance? Instead people like you are like crabs in a bucket and try their damnest to bring people down.
    Your views reflect a lot of what the current PLP is all about, shoot the messenger, play the race card at every chance, and blame the UBP for everything wrong in this country. It’s getting old!

  76. As you are not a member of any union, you obviously could not be angry because the Government asked to review the arbitrated awards.
    This is classic Vanzo-Furbertian-Syndicalist logic.

    But there are are 5 people who call the talk shows on a regular basis that are upset and angry and they’re all UBP supporters.
    It’s funny, I didn’t think anyone could squeeze a word in edgewise amongst Laverne Furbert’s strident radio commentary. Possibly those UBP supporters are frustrated with countering her bullying attacks, twisted dialectic, and character assassinations.

  77. No Ms. Furbert, mother of Vanz Chapman, this has not turned into Bermuda Sucks. If it was Bermuda Sucks your racist son, Mr. Vanz Chapman of Toronto Canada, would be lobbing offensive slurs such as ‘crackers’ or ‘the cracker brigage’ or ‘hitler’ as his arguments crumbled under the weight of their own stupidity.

    He’s not there yet, but I think we’re getting close.

  78. “As you are not a member of any union, you obviously could not be angry because the Government asked to review the arbitrated awards.”

    Now this is simply a bizzare statement to make. What are those in the specific unions affected the only people either allowed or capable of being angry at the government’s move?

    I’m member of none of the Bermudian unions or any of the political parties, yet I find myself being in complete solidarity with the workers who are finding that their pay raise is being sacrificed for spiffy cars for government (both British and Bermudian) officials. Yet it seems that I should not be angry over this slight to the workers, so much for class solidarity, I guess I’ll return to the quiet life of not giving a shit.

  79. Vanz,

    Isn’t there a PLP MP in court right now for stealing money??? Guess you conveinently forgot that while referring to Mr. Crockwell.

    Ms. Furbert,

    Are you saying that wasn’t you referring to Mr. Crockwell as a “confused negro” in that PLP rally posted earlier?? Definitely not a term you use huh?? HAHAHAHAHAHAH…both of you are jokes

  80. On that note, it seems that there has been a hestitation on the part of the BIU leadership to support their fellow unions here. Where’s the solidarity when those same fellow unions have jumped to support the BIU in its own past conflicts? Are the BIU leadership placing their own political relationships and aspirations above the workers’ needs?

    And forgive my asking, but why is the BIU hostile to the BTUC?

    Does Ms Fubert’s great hostility towards the BAMZ reveal why Government seems to hobble the progress of that popular institution?

    The Premier seems atypically off balance. I am not an elitist. I am not a coward. Or as Politics says I am not a crook.

  81. Quote – Bermuda Sucks has now moved to “Catch A Fire”!! I’m really not sure if I want to enter a dialogue wtih you all, but I’ll give it a try. – End Quote

    Are we not good enough to enter into dialogue with you MS. Furbert. Are you not up for a healty democratic debate and would rather shut down or not even begin discussions with people that don’t think like you? Do you believe or even understand the term democracy and the inherent rights that it entails? So if we diasgree with you it is of your belief that we are not worthy of conversing with you?

    Vanz,

    There’s that racist talk that you seem to spew out on other sites. I see you put somewhat of a second face on for this site. But once again when the criticism starts coming your way, so do the “white boy,” “cracker, honky and red neck” cracks as well. I wonder if you refer to your white Canadian friends in the same manner? Don’t you think your constant use of derogatory terms ultimately hurts the PLP and its reputation? I mean I will definitely not view the whole Party based on your constant digs and derogatory slants and racist ways, but I don’t believe it would help the way the PLP is perceived. But who cares about all these crackers right? According to your past posts Bermuda needs these “biscuits” like we need exempt companies!!!

  82. Ok, I dont understand why this has evolved into a “Bash laverne Furbert” exercise.
    Just as you all are entitled to your hatred for Dr Brown, Ms. furbert is entitled to support Dr. Brown and entitled to her opinion.
    I can tell you that I know many of the people that marched on Friday and while there may be discontent at some levels with the labour situation and its ‘resolutions’, that does not automatically translate into loss of support for the PLP government. And to clarify even further, even people that may be annoyed or disappointed even with the PLP govt are not even considering switching allegiances to the UBP, much to the dismay of some of you.
    Within the party of course there are those that dont like Dr. Brown. As Ms. Furbert stated, there were those that didnt like Dame Jennifer, Alex Scott, and leaders prior. However, most within the party, realize that the Party is bigger than an individual leader. Most of you that seem to be experts on the runnings of the PLP, and experts on the ‘rampant discontent’ within, I believe have never set foot in Alaska Hall, nor had extensive conversations with members. And with members, I say members plural, because a conversation with 1 disillusioned supporter does not represent the sentiments of the entire membership.
    There will be no perfect government, no perfect Party, no perfect Leader. Yes this government has made mistakes. And will make more.
    I am disappointed really that Jonathan has let this blog deteriorate into a PLP bashing vehicle, as he is a PLP member. Yes he has the right to constructively criticize, but Jonathan also has the ability, as does Alsys, to come to Alaska Hall and keep the criticism in house.
    Prior to the election, had one read the RG, the blogs, the virus emails etc, one may have thought the UBP would be elected, however the Bermudian people know that the bulk of the authors of these writings of discontent are in the minority and the electorate is wise enough to know who in the end will really have their best interests at heart.
    I agree the PLP has a lot of work to do. I am confident they are up for the challenge. They are intelligent, wise, capable, and inspired. I also can assure you that once this labour situation is sorted out, the PLP will have retained the mass support from the unions.

  83. 9PS,

    There may be a PLP MP on trial for stealing, however he has not been convicted so therefore that point is irrelevant. Mr. Crockwell was convicted.

  84. Read Ms. Furbert’s comments that I posted. She doesn’t think that anyone that is of an opposing view isn’t worthy of her dialogue?!!! And you don’t think that was worthy of a rebuttal or bashing as you put it.

    Then she said the “confused negro” statement is one she doesn’t use or utilize, when it is on youtube for the world to see?? And then her son can go wild on all these blogs and call all white Bermudians these derogatory terms on a daily basis!!?? But we shouldn’t “bash” or retaliate to Ms. Furbert or her precious and ever so articulate son??!!

    Not going to happen, and is is the same way i expect a fierce reaction if a UBP supporter or non-PLP supporter used terms in a derogatory manner to describe my black Bermudian counterparts.

    In the MS. Furbert can brush off the demonstration and soldarity of the workers as she pleases. But these are the individuals with the power and not her. There is a major difference between supporting your party and blind allegiance.

  85. Mr. Crockwell was convicted before he became an active member in public service. I’m awaiting if this MP will be convicted. BIG difference. This government is no stranger to providing favours to its supporters.

  86. “I am disappointed really that Jonathan has let this blog deteriorate into a PLP bashing vehicle, as he is a PLP member.”

    Ken, I believe that if you read his latest post on this blog you will realize that Jonny is off the island, and has been for a few days now, his last post on this thread being # 43 at 1:48 on Sunday, and since then there has been 52 further posts (as of this writing), and it is in them that I think you find most of the Furbert and PLP bashing. He has stated that he will have sporadic, if that, internet connection while away, hence I think it is a little unfair to accuse him of not currently moderating this site to your liking when he physically is incapable of doing so.

  87. Enlightened,

    Mr Crockwell may have been convicted prior to his public service but he was employed as a member of the court system and stole a large quantity of heroin from the courts where it was stored as evidence in a case. If I am not mistaken, these drugs were never recovered. The money that the government MP is charged with stealing is less than 1/10 of the value of the heroin that Mr. Crockwell stole. In addition, I reiterate that he has not been convicted, however history has shown that whenever a PLP person is accused of something, it automatically means guilt in the eyes of some of you.

  88. Why is automaitically a PLP bashing thread? This is the internet and we live in a democracy which entitles the inherent right of all humans in the manner of free speech. What about the 5,000 or so workers that expressed their discontent vocally at Sen. Burch last Friday? Do you consider that “PLP bashing” and that should also be monitored and censured?

    Again, because we are not praising Mr. Chapman and Ms. Furbert for being so biased and hateful, this blog should be monitored and censored?

  89. Where does the good conversationalist Rolfe stand in the pantheon of Convict heroes?

  90. Ken,

    I’m glad mr. Crockwell put the money to good use – He went to school and became a lawyer and has been very active in this country. If convicted, I’d like to know how Mr. Bascome spent his taxpayers loot.
    And while we are on the subject of money. Why is it that some government departments are many years behind reporting their financial records to the auditor general? I think any rational person would be suspicious knowing this…

  91. 9Ps,

    I never said to praise Mr. Chapman or Ms. Furbert. But they are entitled to their opinions, as you are.

    Mambo,
    I never condemned Mr Crockwell for his activities. My reason for posting was because the government MP was brought up, and you can’t criticize one without criticizing them all. My point was that the government MP has not been convicted so it is not exactly comparing apples to apples.

  92. Enlightened,

    Ok, kudos to Mr Crockwell for going to school on the backs of drug money that has destroyed much of the community! Gold star for him!

    I dont know how Mr. Crockwell paid for his education.

    Secondly, if I am not mistaken Mr. Bascome stands accused of stealing from Bank of Bermuda, not the government.

    Also while I agree the financial records should be up to date, unaudited does not mean unaccounted for…and in addition, the reporting has been behind for decades and are more up to date then before.

  93. Stealing is stealing. Does not matter where the money has come from it is still stealing and against the law. I did not say that Mr. Bascome is guilty, so don’t accuse me of that. Is it not that bad then because the money has been taken from a local bank, where Bermudians of all types, deposit their hard earned cash?

    I believe that I read somewhere during the election that Mr. Charles Richardson is affiliated with the PLP in some way. If I am mistaken then I apologize. But some people do change from the stupidity that they once were overwhelmed with as a young person.

    This is Bermuda so don’t act like you don’t have relatives or close friends that “acted up” and got into trouble at some point in their lives. I know I have plenty of those people in my lineage as well as individuals that I consider to be close friends.

  94. 9Ps,

    I never brought up the criminal ‘issue’ in the first place. All I did was say that if you are attacking Minister Bascome, then there are others that can be identified as well. The difference is that others have been convicted, and he has not.

  95. I never attacked Mr. Bascome. The issue of Mr. Crockwell was mentioned I believe by Mr. Chapman and thus Mr. Bascome’s situation was brought to the attention of the readers. Just because he was mentioned doesn’t mean the perosn is “attacking” him. That is the thing with many PLP supporters, you mention someone from the PLP and you are not a PLP supporter yourself it is taken as an attack or a bashing.

    From what I understand Mr. Bascome has done much good in his Pembroke community and is thus well respected. But in the end if found guilty, which I believe he won’t be, then he must pay the price as any individual should if found to be of some wrong doing no matter where the actual monies were taken from, Government or a local banking institution.

  96. Crockwell nor Bascombe nor Commissiong are in charge of the present governments purse strings, and as such, their past and present naughty behavior is insignificant when compared to the highly questionable behaviour of our current leader and his small band of insiders. Our focus should be on the many, many highly paid consultants from the US, Rock Newman ( sp ), David Durham, the Premier’s favourite Portugese contractors ( no bid contracts ) and why the current W&E Minister was moved from his former ministry.

  97. Indeed, we should assume innocence until proven guilty.

    Either way, it’s irrelevant. The salient issues here IMHO are the government’s inability to work with labour, and to a lesser degree the government’s poor financial control and policymaking that may be responsible for tax increases and have played a role in increasing economic pressure on blue collar workers. But if you guys want to bicker about personal issues then we will not make progress.

  98. Can you confirm Mr. Richardson’s PLP status? Is he a junior minister for the Party or affiliated in any way with the PLP?

  99. Juilian Hall is also a known PLP insider. Not much history with being in trouble with the law there….

  100. I believe Mr. Richardson entertained the thought of running for parliament in the last election, for the PLP, but in the end decided against it.

  101. Morning all.

    Ms Furbert.

    Again thank you for taking the time to respond to myself and others on this site. It is a good thing to exchange ideas no matter where you stand in my opinion.

    In response to your post directed at myself, I’m not exactly sure why you cannot understand the protest. Do you mean the manner of it or the reasons for it? If it is the reasons, I think not having a raise for a few years while inflation is rising at an elevated rate (as per Government statistics) might have something to do with it. That and being an “essential service” who’s job involves risking the lives and safety of yourself and your family, especially in light of the rise in violent crime (again from the Government stats) yet are being “nickled and dimed” by those who claim to support you.

    As to my comment about Dr. Brown not remembering my conversation, I was actually being facetious. I do apologize if that was confusing. I meant that he is a man who meets amny people and a ten second conversation would probably not be in his top memories. Again, I said I admire the guy – did you not read that part? So that spiel about dictators etc etc is a moot point when directed at myself. Check out some of my postings on Bermuda Sucks. I spend copious amounts of time defending both the PLP and Dr. Brown. (But you shag one sheep… ha). All I am saying is exatly what Ken posts later on, “the Party is bigger than an individual Leader”. You are spending loads of time attacking me when I support the party, both here, on other blogs and in RL. Does that make any sense to you? Don’t we both want what is best for PLP, the government and by extension, Bermuda?

    Oh, by the by, “disenfranchise” also refers to the loss of a right or privalege (sp?). I’d say those protesters are disenfranchised. But you can use any word you wish.

    How to govern the island better? I’m not a politician so I have ideas but of course, I don’t know implementation. But here’s a couple. Spend more time on the island. Stop making kneejerk decisions to deal with issues and examine the consequences. Involve us in decisions – PATI or other transparency. That’s a weird one, cause I don’t think a government should be totally transpaprent. I pay them to do a job and I think we should let them get on with it. But some access is necessary if only for checks and balances. I could go on but for brevity sake I won’t. If you wish to talk in more detail about this, I can give you my email address. I’ve said this stuff and more to quite a few MPs, on both sides.

    Can I ask one question though, why is it I mention the premier’s car and immediately you “deflect and accuse”? Two wrongs do not make rights but instead of you examining the point I put forward, you insist of telling me about other situations. I agree, the premier and the governor should be on the same level (with Dr Brown being more important of course) but when did this become a pissing contest? A 90k car is not necessary for either, I agree. Now can we get back to the issue, which is when the governemnt is rejecting a 1% more raise, the premier is getting a brand spanking new car… Does that not seem sad to you?

    Just because I am not a member of the unions, I am not allowed to be angry with what they protested about? The teachers will be educating my children, the police keep my island safe… hell, yes, I’m affected. This island is a microsystem and everything that happens affects other parts.

    And for the record, Ken, if you read over any of the comments of those in support of PLP on here and BermudaSucks, there is not a very large loss of support for PLP. I certainly am not. Disagreeing with current policy means I have issues with that alone. I believe in PLP and I believe in quite a few of the MPs. But I, like many others, feel that Dr. Brown no longer considers us, much less believes in us. I’m not so much angry by that as hurt. We gave of our time, our support and now we feel like that matters not at all to him. No, that’s not everyone in PLP, but I am speaking for quite a few disappointed people.

  102. Ok, let’s not get carried away. Julian Hall has been convicted of no crimes.

    But, Rolfe Commiong was convicted of armed robbery. So Vanz, why bring up Crockwell’s past?

    You are living in a dream world if you think that black PLP members and voters are not upset with this Premier. You insult the intelligence fof your won people to suggest we must blindly suppiort any leader, so long as he is black.

    I notice you don’t addreses the questions raised by Drummer Boy. Hey, don’t worry about it man, don’t hurt your head. It’s all just propaganda right? Go ahead, convince your self that this is a white racist writing this. It is too much for you to imagine that this could be someone who actually is black and is a PLP member.

  103. PLP Member,
    Dont know if you are talking to me, but I will say that i didnt say that PLP members or voters are not upset with this Premier or the government. And I certainly dont think we should blindly support any leader based on race. But I will say that discontent with the unions and discontent on certain issues does not automatically translate to abandonment of support.

    Drummer Boy makes some very valid claims. He is entitled to his opinions whether they are supported by 15000 or 1.

  104. Alsys,

    With regard to the car, the Premier did not haphazardly get a new car. The previous car has been out of commission since before the election. Sometimes maintenance of a car, with ongoing issues ends up not financially worth it. I personally do not think 90K is that ridiculous for the leader of the country. Don’t forget that this is not his car, it is the car for whoever is sitting in the office of the Premier. And personally, I dont recall any hoopla when the Governor got a new car, that we paid for. No it’s not a pissing contest, but I would rather my elected leader of Bermudian heritage be in the car. I know friends that have purchased BMWs costing more than 90K. Yes it is the tax payers money. 90K divided by 60000 people equated to 1.33 a person. I am ok with that.

  105. the car came from the UK n’est ce pas?, so more like 130k but hey whatever – it was inappropriate choice at a time when the economy is heading into a tailspin and many Bermudians are so much poorer as wages have not kept pace with inflation. As long as the urban myth of Bermuda writing out checks for the Governor’s car are swallowed hook line etc and so forth. I would have thought that Ewart who is the grand dame of gesture politics would have loved to have taken delivery of a hybrid or a car that might require a little less time in the shop.

  106. Ken,

    I know it’s trivial but I don’t think there are 60,000 taxpayers in Bermuda. You’re taking the total population instead of the tax paying population. Thus, it shold equate to a little more than 1.33 per person. I’m fine with the car but don’t tell our police officers they can’t get a raise when you’re out spending money like there’s no tomorrow.

  107. My 2 cents.

    The GP1 issue is a non-starter … Why shouldn’t the Premier get to drive the same type of car as the Governor? … and hey this is Bermuda … most of us spend way too much on our cars … its a Bermudian thing … move on … inappropriate in the current fiscal climate perhaps but not illegal.

    The real issue of recent days is the marginalisation and objectification of all the women by our Premier … from the ones who stuff envelopes into the wee hours to those who hold parliamentary seats to those who share his home … by clearly emphasising his personal enjoyment and willingness to return to the Playboy mansion for more the Premier has successfully marginalised and objectified all women by inference … porn is porn Doctor Brown and Bermuda does not support this activity … in fact we strictly regulate it within out our borders.

    Then there is the issue on hold. According to Col. Burch the “binding” arbitration awards are to be subject to judicial review … once before the judiciary these matters will not be (and should not be) advanced until the judiciary has given their ruling … the unions affected will have to wait for this American styled delay to run its course … yet again the courts will be used to delay and defer a serious issue … this is not the first time our courts have been used in such a manner and I fear it will not be the last … any objections to the course of judicial review will be met with the fiscal responsibility argument … that the court action is only to protect our rights and interests as taxpayers and to ensure that the law of the land is followed … pretty hard to critise that.

    Darkside.

  108. My 2 cents. (Most typos fixed)

    The GP1 issue is a non-starter … Why shouldn’t the Premier get to drive the same type of car as the Governor? … and hey this is Bermuda … most of us spend way too much on our cars … its a Bermudian thing … move on … inappropriate in the current fiscal climate perhaps but not illegal.

    The real issue of recent days is the marginalisation and objectification of all the women of the party by our Premier … from the ones who stuff envelopes into the wee hours to those who hold parliamentary seats to those who share his home … by clearly emphasizing his personal enjoyment and willingness to return to the Playboy mansion for more the Premier has successfully marginalised and objectified all women by inference … porn is porn Doctor Brown and Bermuda does not support this activity … in fact we strictly regulate it within our borders.

    Then there is the issue on hold. According to Col. Burch the “binding” arbitration awards are to be subject to judicial review … once before the judiciary these matters will not be (and should not be) advanced until the judiciary has given their ruling … the unions affected will have to wait for this American styled delay to run its course … yet again the courts will be used to delay and defer a serious issue … this is not the first time they have been used in such a manner and I fear it will not be the last … any objections will be met with the fiscal responsibility argument … that the court action is only to protect our rights and interests as taxpayers and to ensure that the law of the land is followed … pretty hard to criticise that.

    Darkside.

  109. Darkside – it’s very easy to be critical of the fiscal responsibility argument simply because they don’t show any everywhere else.

    Penny wise on things that matter, pound stupid on pie in the sky and personal projects.

    The Southlands land swap alone was a transfer of tens of millions of dollars out of the citizen’s (government’s) balance sheet… and there are literally dozens of other examples of easily avoidable knee-jerk decision making and poor management that have in total cost each of us tens of thousands of dollars… to say nothing of the questionable insider deals.

  110. It’s all a question of size…as the actress said…

    Sorry – will be serious. In the US and the UK, the Presidents car and the Prime Ministers car can be changed without anyone noticing.

    Here – you just can’t do that. It’s a small island with what must be for the Premier quite frustrating, conservative views and behaviour. Add to that the rumours of ‘why’ it had to be changed, plus the fact that Derek Burgess said “it arrived Monday”…when we all know it’s been here for some time…etc, etc…and it becomes an issue. If you don’t believe that Ken – ask the taxi drivers. They’ll even tell you where it was stored!!

    And the issue would not be there if this Premier behaved as if he was in Bermuda, rather than thinking he was in the US.

    And Laverne and Ken…it’s no good trying to support the Prem. We know what you have to do and why you do it, so really there is little point. In fact, Laverne does it to the point of absurdity and that in turn p….s off the PLP members as well as the UBP supporters.

    For goodness sake, if you want to protect him, tell him to protect himself by changing his behaviour. He must stop making this Govt look a set of prats (“You attack me – you attack the Govt”) by his behaviour and get on with the substantive issues facing this island.

    You have members of the PLP, members of the various trade unions etc, facing hardship. As yet – I have seen “nothing” introduced that helps them, that alleviates the pain and worry.

    Laverne says the PLP is not socialist. (She has never answered my question about where you sit politically), but that said,try being a compassionate one for a change.

  111. DeOnion,

    I agree that it would appear that the government selectively utilises the application of its fiscal responsibility and clearly one can be critical of that … but in this case they can clearly state they are ensuring the protection of all of our interests as taxpayers and that our laws are followed … if there happen to be some fringe benefits that come from adopting such a course then its a windfall for them … I can only hope that at the end of all this delay (smoke and mirrors) that the union workers get what they are entitled to and I trust in our judiciary to ensure this occurs in the most timely manner.

    Darkside.

  112. drugs have disproportionately ravaged the blk community – knowing this – shawn crockwell stole and sold heroin to the sons and daughters of bda – destroying many lives while ding so – he wans’t a child making a sudden decision he was a man making a calculated decision to destroy people lives all so that he could have better life – remember – he had the money to got school – he sold the drugs so that he could have a swankier lifestyle while he was in school. he’s a scumbag for stealing drugs from the courts and killing the lives of blk children in bda.

    the fact that the ubp chose to run him in a safe seat where irrationally scared white folks vote for whoever the ubp run in that riding says a lot – it says that they can’t attract quality blk candidates and that ubp voters vote so blindly that they would elect a heroin dealer (and probably a pedophile)

    in 1996 the rg and the rest of the haterz scaremongered and the plp won – and they’ve continued to do so since then yet the plp continue to win and gain support (the last 3 elections the UBP won they won with less than 50% of the popular vote – the last 3 that the plp won they won with up to 54% of the popuation)

    the truth is the election is at least 4 years away – the labour issue will be long settled – the economy will have turned around and the plp will win again – the haterz know this and hate it yet can do nothing about it and they’re frustration shows.

    dr. brown will serve out as long as he wants and ride off onto the sunset and having met the next generation of plp leaders who will lead bda in the future i can assure u that dr. brown is the prototype for them – as much as the haterz pray for a confused negro to lead bda (again) – it’s not gonna happen – crockwell, hunt and darius are not cv, edness and swan.

    there’s a existential parable where a guard warns an opponent that ” even if u defeat me” the guard behind me is bigger and stronger and the one behind him is even bigger and stringer and so on…the haterz can delude themselves into thinking that if dr, brown leaves then we can go back to the uncle tom days – sorry – like great white dope dunkley who was gonna save the day for the ubp – not gonna happen

  113. plp insider III = vanz chapman

    “shawn crockwell stole and sold heroin to the sons and daughters of bda” – how many times are you going to say the exact same thing?! Every time you talk about Shawn Crockwell you say that. And I wonder how LF feel’s about you posting under an alias…stand by your convictions vanz and post under your real name!

  114. Erm…

    How did this turn into a “hate blog”? The thread (some time ago) was Drummer Boy’s writings.

  115. I’ll have to agree with Fast Fred that PLP insider II and PLP insider III seem suspiciously like the doings of one Vanz Chapman, I guess he’s up to his old bullshit again.

  116. on 2nd thought I’ll have to disagree with Fast Fred. PLP insider II and PLP insider III don’t seem like the doings of one Vanz Chapman,

  117. Hey Vanz/PLP II/PLP III/Fast Fred II/Dylan., I can see clearly now that you are a shining beacon of internet maturity and an example to us all.

    I thank you from the depth of my heart for your soul felt demonstration of how to engage people with different opinions in constructive dialog and criticism. I’m sure generations from now they will be showing your internet writings to school children on all of the Earth’s many continents as an example to be upheld in the field of reason and logic.

  118. the nom de plumes of Chapman is the first line of his playbook; when others make him look like a fool revert to attention seeking disruption.

  119. Yes Vanz I think we all already knew that one, but thanks for airing it, after all they say the road to recovery begins with first admitting we have a problem.

  120. How old are we Vanz/Vance? 3?

    You seem easily able to take the entirety of immature behavior in a given situation and distill it into a single post. Congratulations on your stunning ability.

  121. … and LVF’s prediction that this has become a Bermuda Sucks site comes true … now that her son has hijacked the discourse in favour of his typical misplaced rantings.

    Thankfully LVF won’t be able to exert the same (alleged) pressure on JS as the PLP/she did over THEIR OWN party’s youth wing blog (progressive minds) which VC completely corrupted and should have been barred from (if the administrators followed their own set of rules). Ironically the same (recurring) application of double standards which the party hierarchy operates under which the “Drummer Boy” takes issue with.

    I think certain of the loyalists are so wrapped up in the party line that their objective minds have become inextricably tangled with the confusion of reconciling self-promotion and personal economic advancement with the party’s mission statement … thereby negating the possibility for “social and economic justice” and completely abandoning any chance of replacing “apathy and alienation with a spirit of optimism and a feeling of oneness and unity”.

  122. well done.

    I imagine from my last meeting with Vance at Alaska Hall that he is in his early 40s.

    Seriously – well done.

  123. The thread is about labour unions disagreeing with government. Drummer Boy did bring up valid concerns which have not yet been answered by anyone who would be in a position to do so.

    However, with the obvious nom-de-plumes being used by certain people, there is a possibility that Chuko/Drummer Boy’s post is also a plant. Vanz does raise an interesting point … do we emphasise the message or the messenger? As long as blogs do not require registration, that is something that we will just have to live with.

    But I don’t agree with Vanz derailing the discussion. Trouble is, many posters rise to the bait.

    I can’t see either side winning this argument. Agreeing to disagree is the best we can hope for.

  124. “I imagine from my last meeting with Vance at Alaska Hall that he is in his early 40s.”

    c’mon now – everyone knows that u can’t tell a blk person’s age from how they look.

    and alaska hall is where – toronto?

  125. The more Vanz talks it becomes more apparent how ignorant he is.

    I don’t think anybody really cares which party is in power. We care about a government that cares about the people and for the common good and not just a select few.

    Vanz speaks as if there is a war between blacks and whites or maybe this is what he wants. People voted on emotion last election and this is what the PLP is good at – stirring up racial emotions that do nothing to benefit this country but instead divide us. This is 2008 and there is no place for Vanz’s thinking or language in Bermuda or the world.

    We truly need to move Bermuda forward and this government is going backwards by not granting cost of living pay increases.

  126. Vance – I guessed your age from reference to common acquaintances we have.

    You looked divine, flav.

  127. The more Vanz talks it becomes more apparent how ignorant he is.

    but i’m typing not talking

    I don’t think anybody really cares which party is in power.

    this makes no sense

    We care about a government that cares about the people and for the common good and not just a select few.

    this makes no sense

    Vanz speaks as if there is a war between blacks and whites or maybe this is what he wants. People voted on emotion last election and this is what the PLP is good at – stirring up racial emotions that do nothing to benefit this country but instead divide us. This is 2008 and there is no place for Vanz’s thinking or language in Bermuda or the world.

    this makes no sense

    We truly need to move Bermuda forward and this government is going backwards by not granting cost of living pay increases.

    wha…?

  128. I understand Vanz, a lot of things in this world must confuse you. You seem to be an easily confused individual.

  129. It appears that he uses the same tactics on multiple sites. Once his usually twisted points aren’t agreed with by someone, he simply starts on a racist tirade throwing derogatory names in regards to white Bermudians. Do you do the same to your white Canadian friends?

  130. I don’t believe that true PLP supporters would ever admit that you stand for what the Party stands for. You are an embarassment to the PLP and Bermuda as a whole.

  131. mambochazbaps Says:
    July 1, 2008 at 2:17 pm

    No semi-skimmed from Ma Klump?

    i see that no one has called this racist

  132. I think this thread has wound it’s course. There’s nothing left here to see. Move on.
    Another discussion bullied into silence.

  133. I have been following “Catch A Fire” since Jonathan first starting blogging It goes without saying that I haven’t always agreed with him, but I admire his tenacity for continuing to blog in spite of those of who disagree with him. However, I am amazed that this particular blog has elicited 155 responses. When I think about that my mind goes back to seeing old movies where dead bodies are left in a desert and the vultures come to eat those dead bodies because that’s where they get their nourishment.

    My first post on this site was #26 and since then 129 mostly negative posts have followed. I would be willing to bet my last dollar that if I had written that Dr. Brown was a scumbug and needed to be tarred and feathered, either before or after he was “dethroned” I would have had a few handclaps, not this outpouring of emotion.

    Enjoy your evening.

  134. Darkside – I agree. You said it better than I did. It’s worth noting that they are similarly selective with their application of both the spirit and letter of the law, as we’ve found it in areas such as the use of the Planning Department as a rubber stamp when convenient.

    If they were truly principled and were consistent in following the law on principle then it would be possible to have sympathy for the government’s position.

  135. When I think about that my mind goes back to seeing old movies where dead bodies are left in a desert and the vultures come to eat those dead bodies because that’s where they get their nourishment.

    Sort of like the PLP’s reps here (other than the host) who are unwilling to argue on or behalf of their party’s lack of action over the last few years in favour of shooting every messenger who disagrees with the party line. Lonely indeed.

  136. 32n64w,

    Say what you like about personality etc, this government has implemented many initiatives to better this country. The election literature highlighted many of the ones implemented since 1998, and also what will we implemented during this term. You may not give credit where credit is due, but the proof was on Dec 18 that the majority of the electorate did in fact see fit to re-elect the PLP to government. You might not agree with their decision, as I am sure you didnt agree in 1998 or 2003, but thats ok. We can agree to disagree.

  137. Ms Furbert

    Thanks for engaging with us, even if some of this is bad stuff. Thanks in particular for engaging with Aslys (not Alys).

    I guess we all cherry pick to a great extent, but it is sad that you don’t tackle some of the other points that genuinely concern people, even though we know why that is.

    Hope you enjoyed your evening.

  138. Ms. Furbert,

    I am sorry that you consider our posts negative, simply because we don’t agree with your points. That’s if you actually had one in those rants of yours. I don’t think you have grasped the actual meaning of free speech. There will always be individuals that don’t agree and they have the right to express their oprinion, as long as it does not incite hatred and racism. On the other hand you have Vanz who publicly uses racial slurs against whites. Do you condone that type of negativity?

    Just wanted to point out your hypocrisies and lies, that’s all. You don’t want your “familial” relationships mentioned on a blog such as this, but you did the exact same thing to Mr. Wells. Then you quote that you don’t use the term “confused negroe” when it is still fresh in our minds from the PLP rally, the RG and it has been on the internet for all to see since your “speech.” How do you explain that one?

    The whole point is that there is obvious discontent from the workers of OUR island. To simply brush them off as “haterz” as some has referred them to is ridiculous and is the reason that these workers feel that the only way to gain recognition from this Government is to down tools and march on Cabinet.

  139. Say what you like about personality etc, this government has implemented many initiatives to better this country. The election literature highlighted many of the ones implemented since 1998, and also what will we implemented during this term

    Ken – I’ve thoroughly read every election platform the PLP has produced over the last three elections. I certainly agree there have been a number of improvements for Bermudians (waiver of stamp duty on primary residence as an example) but in all honesty found the last document to be extremely repetitive and given the six months that have gone by not much has been acted upon (how hard is to not charge for using public transportation.

    In the last ten years we’ve seen a surge in government receipts but, on balance, I see no major or demonstrable improvement in the day to day quality of the average Bermudian’s life(style). Housing, education, crime & tourism (always election buzz words and rarely followed through after the fact) continue to be serious issues plaguing our society.

    Where is the Hopkins Report?

    Where is the report on poverty?

    Where are the new hotels?

    What is the plan for the ‘new’ hospital (given that Mrs. Minors was of the opinion KEMH was on the verge of collapse)?

    Where are the safer streets?

    Where is PATI legislation?

    … on, and on, and on, and on …

    Ultimately, where is accountability for the repeated failures to perform on these election year promises?

    C’mon already … it’s been ten years the training wheels are long gone. Get it together PLP and start performing or hand over the reins to a party with a proven track record of success for Bermudians (not just the one’s sitting in the House or on the friends and family plan).

  140. Nice response 9Ps.

    Ken, the only thing that I can think of that has improved my life is that my trash gets picked up twice a week. Which arguably has been a negative impact because people now have an incentive to throw more things in the garbage and it isn’t helpful to the enviroment. Can you name some others?

  141. Well, I can think of quite a few positives by the PLP.

    1. PRC legislation. Not perfect, but they did something after years of the UBP pussy-footing around. It is mostly fair to those affected.

    2. Better public transportation. Although I cannot really use this for work, it does run many times better than it did before. The ferries are a definite plus. It does need longer operating hours, though, and rough weather capability for the ferries.

    3. GPS in cabs. Taxi drivers whine too damn much. If they actually showed up for fares when called, these wouldn’t be needed. They don’t, so they have to be monitored. Remember, a taxi has to be available for hire for 16 hours per day. I used to see them at Mid Ocean, Ocean View, Belco, and Tynes bay for hours on end. No more.

    4. Term limits for work permits. There are pluses and minuses to this, but I think overall it’s a plus. There are exemptions for key employees, and it serves to minimize the amount of permit holders who would eventually have to leave after a very extended stay, which would be an emotional thing for them and their friends. Hopefully it will lead to the training of Bermudians.

    5. Hustle truck. There will always be the unemployables, for whatever reason. At least with this scheme, they can do something useful and get something for their effort. If it helps someone to turn their life around, it will be an unqualified success. I should move this up the list, I think it’s one of the best.

  142. Renaissance,

    Agreed with all of the above. I, myself have never accused the PLP of being a party lacking in ambition and ideas. I have a problem with some of the divisive rhetoric utilized by some of its members and MPs. It does nothing for the progress of Bermuda as a WHOLE.

    I also disagree with the tactics that the current leadership are using as well. The shutdown of healthy demcratic debate, the non-transparency of government issued contracts and the way they were awarded and the misuse/appropriation of tax dollars (i.e. faith Based tourism)are amongst my issues with the leadership of the Government in power .

    It is OUR tax dollars that are going unaccounted for, not just one sector of the population and they must be held accountable for these actions. It is our democratic right and duty to question these individuals on the use of such funds. To do so doesn’t amount to one being a racist or a traitor to their own race, it amounts to one being an pro-active democratic citizen and one that is interested in how this country is run for us and our future generations to come.

  143. PS: i know it’s not the Government’s fault but BDA’s taxi service remains to be, probably, the most unreliable I have ever encountered!!

  144. While I will agree with all 5 positives listed I think those are all things that have helped better the lives of Bermudians. However, I believe there are more substantial things that can be done to directly improve Bermudians standard of living.

    These include:

    1) Improving education – including the physical structures as well as the curriculum taught within the institutions. We should stop lowering the bar and instead raise the bar in order to be a global compeititor.

    2) Healthcare – We desperately need a new hospital and an entity capable of running it. I’ve heard first hand horror stories from people who have had terrible experiences there and frankly I’m afraid to get medical attention on the island.

    3) Improve Our Ifrastructure – our roads are in a state of embarrassment. I feel like I need a motorcross or an SUV to manuever around the island.

    4) Policing – crime is on the rise. Tourists are being robbed, beaten and murdered. We have an increased presence of guns and gang related incidents and our roads are turning into graveyards.

    5) Affordable Housing – lets face it. Loughlands isn’t really affordable to the average Bermudian earning less than $45,000 net per year. We need solutions to the social problems created with people sharing 2 bedroom homes with 4 and 5 families.

    6) Senior Care – Our seniors are being neglected. I’ve visited an assisted living facility in the past few months and it is not up to the 20th century. We need to find a better way to take care of our seniors.

    7) PATI – We, the citizens of Bermuda need more acces to information. This will increase accountability and transparency.

    8) Better Public Transportation – a great example of this is when I returned from the July 4th celebration in Dockyard on Sat. evening. My guest and I waited for over two hours to get from Dockyard to Hamilton. The two ferries that were supposed to show up at 10:30 pm were a no show. These ferries need to run extended hours and so do the busses. Busses and ferries should run until at least 3 am.

    9) Tourism – Tourism is a complete sham. Everyone knows that without the business travelers we would have considerably less ‘tourists’. We need to market to a demographic that really matches Bermuda’s strengths. Whatever happened to college weeks? Why can’t we get that demographic back? Where are the hotels that have been promised to us for years? Instead we have hotels closing.

    I’m sure I can go on but these are the first things that came to mind.

  145. And thus Vanz, we really don’t care which party does these things, we just want them DONE!

  146. If we could just delete the knee-jerk reactions and foolishness from this thread I think we would see that some people (such as Mrs. Furbert, Mike, Alsys, and Darkside for starters) are actually trying to have a dialogue here. They may disagree with each other but they are not resorting to personal attacks, ridicule etc. The disruptive behaviour of some other posters is disrespectful to the principle of serious debate, and to the owner of this site who (whether one agrees with his opinions or not) is dedicated to open and serious discussion of issues facing Bermuda and its workers.

    As I noted over on Bermuda Rocks/Sucks, Chuko’s post hits home with me. I had (and still have) high hopes for the PLP. From my perspective the UBP is an extraordinarily weak opposition, lacks a strong sense of party identity, can’t seem to face up to the need to discuss race, appears to be out of touch and generally speaking just can’t get its act together. It doesn”t really form a viable or credible “government in waiting”. To be crude: no teeth, no balls. The PLP, with all its imperfections (and there are a lot) is still, to me, the more promising party.

    Maybe its a healthy sign that people who are members of the PLP and who have voted for the party feel comfortable discussing their misgivings and debating about other ways forward for the party (albeit under pseudonyms).

    The PLP have formed the government for 10 years. I think it’s time to stop circling the wagons and acting from a defensive position, and time to start acting from a position of strength and inviting the disappointed party supporters and others to talk. And all credit to Mrs. Furbert, that is what she is doing here. In addition she is acknowledging that others have a right to their opinion, and a right to express it.

    Is there any merit to the concerns expressed by Chuko and others? Even though the nature of politics demands a certain skepticism and suspicion of one’s opponents in such situations, I have to say that in this case I think the opinions expressed are shared by many who are not UBP supporters. I am one. And I can certainly say that Alsys is another, based on her contributions to the debate at Bermuda Rocks/Sucks.

    If Dr. Brown actually has the welfare and interests of the country and its people at heart for God’s sakes get him a good PR adviser and make him pay attention to their advice. Because right now that is not the message that is coming across.

    On the other hand if he doesn’t have the interests of the country and its people at heart no amount of PR advice can conceal it. And I am afraid that is what we are seeing right now.

  147. It took me so long to compose my post that I didn’t see those that have been posted in the meantime. Apologies if my post appears to ignore those contributions.

  148. urchin,

    Ms. Furbert is not open to dialogue and this is obvious from her posts on this site, letters to the editor and her rants on the talk shows etc. Anyone, and I mean anyone, that seems to have an issue with the ruling party is simply shot down as being null and void I mean just yesterday she stated that she doesn’t want to enter into a dialogue (post #65) with “us.” And then she completely disregards the many valid points that Chuko/Drummer Boy had posted and stated that he must be the surrogate son of the “son of the soil.” If you consider not even trying to gauge where the opposing argument is coming from as “entering into dialgue” then Ms. Furbert is the most articulate person on this piece of Rock. She can’t expect no reactions from her outspoken and usually offending manner. So I am sorry, but a knee jerk reaction is what you will see if individuals such as Ms. furbert see no wrong in their divisive comments and actions.

  149. for God’s sakes get him a good PR adviser and make him pay attention to their advice
    A PR advisor is not the answer; they just help justify your decisions or spin an issue. We need a return to concepts of good governance. What can be done to fulfill the potential of all Bermudians? What is Bermuda’s business and what needs to be done to protect/grow it? How much government does Bermuda need and how should it be run?
    The Bermuda Government these days is all about THEM. It is rarely about US.

  150. 9Ps:

    What Mrs. Furbert actually wrote was “I’m really not sure if I want to enter a dialogue wtih you all, but I’ll give it a try.” She has also repeatedly said that others are entitled to their opinion and to expression of that opinion. In my view her overture is deserving of a sincere response.

    If you don’t agree with her points, fine, but I don’t think that attacking her vehement style of posing them will get the debate anywhere positive.

  151. Gombey Mansion:

    I am in agreement with you on the need to address the core issues of governance, and on the general role of PR.

    My point was that if Dr. Brown is in fact serious about these core issues, as his supporters seem to think, then his public image is in dire need of work. My belief is that no amount of spin or polish can conceal the truth about Dr. Brown. I m sorry if I wasn’t clear about that.

  152. Urchin,

    That is your interpretation and I accept that. But you seemed to miss out my main point is that she is NOT tolerant of any views that contradict her or the PLP as a whole.

    I remember not too long ago when the teachers were upset and how they were being treated and her letter to the editor shot down all their legitimate concerns and basically told them to stop whining. I am sorry I don’t have the letter on hand to quote exactly her response, but I do remember being outraged that she would actually brush aside these workers feelings and concerns just to “toe the party line.” That is exactly the type of attitude that brought about the Friday demonstration to begin with.

    As I mentioned before there is a difference between supporting one’s party and blind allegiance. Ms. Furbert, I believe, falls in the latter category. But what really bothers me is that questions have been put forward to her several times on this thread alone and her answer is “don’t call vanz my son.”

    On top of that why woud Ms. furbert not be “sure if she wants to enter into dialogue” with us? Are we not worthy of her conversation? Is an opposing view so horrendous and unthinkable in her eyes that we are not deemed good enough from a Ms. Furbert reponse?

    Also, you left out my point of her divisive language that she utilizes everytime she opens her mouth. Do you agree with this type of talk, that is doing nothing but creating greater divisions within our society? Cause I don’t and I won’t tolerate them from whosever mouth they came from. Please don’t ask to what I am referring to, cause there is a youtube link on this post alone which exemplifies this.

  153. Sorry one more thing:

    Ms. Furbert,

    Not too long ago I wrote a letter to the editor in response to your use of the word “indigenous.” In my letter I told you that I am from Portuguese heritage, but my family has been in Bermuda for 6 plus generations now and my family holds no property, to show that not all white’s are born with a silver spoon up their backside. Your response was “sorry to hear that, but all the Portuguese should thank Ms. Paula Cox for us being able to live in Bermuda. As much as I respect the dignity of Ms. Cox, what the hell are you talking about??!!

  154. Urchin,

    Thank you for your kind words which I doubt I am worthly of receiving.

    Personally I feel that Ms. Furbert’s words should not be confused with those of Mr. Chapman … I would hate to be accountable to all for the actions and words of my adult relations (my underage children yes … adults no). Ms. Furbert has as valid a point of view as any of the posters here … she is Bermudian and resident in this island and that gives her words the weight they require in order for a discourse to occur … in addition we must be cognisant of the fact that she (like myself) has first hand knowledge of many of the defining events in our history that some of our younger posters may not have … however, as with all posters, she will be subject to correction of her stated facts (as occurred further up this thread) … while I do not agree with many of her views her voice is still entitled to be heard (as are all of our Bermudian voices) … ad hominem attacks upon her are not warranted and stifle true discourse.

    The above being said I would truly like to hear Ms. Furbert’s views (as a woman) of the apparent marginalisation and objectification of the women of the party by our Premier given his stated enthusiam for further trips to the playboy mansion.

    PS: I thank DeOnion as well for his/her kind words … which again I am likely unworthy of receiving.

  155. 9Ps:

    I apologise for not addressing all your points. Without addressing each of your details, I agree that Mrs. Furbert generally has a combative style of engagement. We all know that.

    She has chosen to engage in debate on this site, and has taken time to present her views and arguments in a sincere manner. To me the only way to respond is to address the issues. If the debate goes nowhere, abandon it. At least you have exchanged views and behaved in a manner you can be proud of.

    As to her uncertainty about debating with posters on this site – that’s her opinion, and that’s her right. I don’t take offence at it myself.

  156. “If you don’t agree with her points, fine, but I don’t think that attacking her vehement style of posing them will get the debate anywhere positive.”

    Hear Hear!!!

    Once thing you can’t argue with is Ms. Furbert’s ability to get a thread going. What a bad time for a trip Jonny.

  157. “As to her uncertainty about debating with posters on this site – that’s her opinion, and that’s her right. I don’t take offence at it myself.”

    That’s where we disagree. As a member of a political party, and one who actually ran for a constituency, for her to even make a suggestion in that manner is inexcusable. Politicans are put in place by us, the people. I know Ms. Furbert wasn’t voted in, so I guess this won’t apply to her at this moment in time. As they achieved their power/position by the vote of the people, they must remain accountable at ALL times by the people. The refusal to answer questions (as is a constant practice these days from certain elected officials)is a direct slap in the face to the public. The attitude of, “well you obviously didn’t vote for me, so your opinions and questions hold no bearing,” is sickening and scary.

    Also, you mentioned that Ms. Furbert has a combatitive style and is praised somewhat for this approach. Why is it when individuals reposnd to her in the same manner it is referred to as “bashing” of Ms. Furbert?

  158. I think the only time we should have political enemies is when there is a group of politicians who are hurting Bermuda badly, either due to their individual greed or inability. Don’t you agree that if we all have Bermuda’s best interests at heart then we shouldn’t have political enemies, just differences of opinion?

    The problem I have is that we are 10 years into the PLP’s time in power and they have lived up to virtually none of their promise and have instead relied on flag waving, spin, and hasty promises to win elections.

    Calling the PLP a party of “ideas” is certainly more accurate than calling them a party of action, although I question how many specific, relevant, and actionable ideas they have managed to come up with. Compare the PLP platforms from 1998 to today with what they have actually done and the staggering sums of money they have spent. Then compare it to the UBP’s current platform, which contains a large number of specific, realistic actions that would truly improve the quality of all of our lives.

    I think the failure of the UBP has been to not show people the reform that comes with losing power and the people who are only in it for the money and image and being left behind with the decent core. Meanwhile the PLP has seen the reverse and become the party of the self-interested and corrupt.

    The UBP as the “United Bermuda Party” does not and will not have a strong identity because by definition it is a party of unifying a wide spectrum of people interested in good government for all of Bermuda.

  159. Please-
    Who is Chuko/Drummer Boy?
    Royal Gazette wants your permission to publish “Our Beloved Premier” that’s going around like wildfire on email.
    It is the most succinct critique of what’s going on in Bermuda today.
    If you read this- call Tania Therialt at RG. They will not publish your name…..but you should be proud of what you wrote!

  160. 9Ps:

    You wrote:
    “Also, you mentioned that Ms. Furbert has a combatitive style and is praised somewhat for this approach. Why is it when individuals reposnd to her in the same manner it is referred to as “bashing” of Ms. Furbert?”

    First, as far as I can see I did not mention that Mrs. Furbert is praised for her combative approach. I merely pointed out that that is her style. It is not something we can change, it is simply something we have to accept.

    As for the second part of your comment, I have never used the word ‘bashing’ in this context, and I can’t really comment except to say that I notice a number of responses which attack Mrs. Furbert rather than her ideas, and therefore in my view constitute ‘bashing’.

  161. Umm, no Urchin. You’re off base there.

    The issue isn’t the style, it’s the threats to supporters and the hypocrisy of her statements. Those are just simply wrong, and it wouldn’t make any difference if they were said nicely or not.

    I don’t get why you can’t criticize people or parties for doing things wrong. Right is right, wrong is wrong. Don’t you discipline children for bad behaviour, but still love them afterwards? (Actually, the lack of discipline is probably the root of all local problems, but that’s for another thread.)

    The child analogy for the PLP is apropos. Full of potential (hugely so), but since they lack confidence and direction, they are boastful about minimal things. Their attention jumps all over the place. They have a tantrum at the suggestion of impropriety or that they may be wrong about something. They’ll take their ball home if the people they are playing with won’t let them change the rules of the game.

    And in the end, with a chance for disciplining them, we chose not to. Therein lies the problem.

  162. I should add that the UBP analogy would be as a senile old fool, just to be fair.

    I would rather take my chance with the potential of the PLP, but have their less than ideal behaviours moderated. That is, I think, the reasoning behind Jon’s postings, and that of Drummer Boy. How can the PLP improve if they won’t accept criticism for the things they do wrong?

    After all, nobody’s perfect, least of all politicians.

  163. Renaissance Man:

    “Umm, no Urchin. You’re off base there.

    The issue isn’t the style, it’s the threats to supporters and the hypocrisy of her statements. Those are just simply wrong, and it wouldn’t make any difference if they were said nicely or not.”

    Absolutely. They are certainly wrong and they are also part of her general style, as I see it.

    “I don’t get why you can’t criticize people or parties for doing things wrong. Right is right, wrong is wrong.”

    Not sure where you got that from my posts – I think criticism is part of debate. But in my view persistently bringing up certain points over and over, as seems to have happened here, and expecting a change in behaviour is not productive and adds nothing to the discussion. Regular readers of online and offline debate in Bermuda are well aware of the general habits of frequent participants in that debate, including the habits of Mrs. Furbert. When debate focuses on these habits, it gets derailed, as has happened in this very discussion. We are now a long way from debating last Friday’s march and the related issues, and I am sorry to have been a party to the diverting of the discussion.

  164. According to the RG, the Govt and the BPSU have come to an agreement for a 5% increase. The Govt and the Unions have also agreed to monthly meetings to maintain a good relationship etc. I think this is a step in the right direction.

  165. Shift gears a few seonds boys and girls – 2.2 million tax payer dollars spent on the Music Fest and the Premier states that anyone that has a problem with this is narrow minded…Hmmmm!!!!!

    The Premier should explain who, other then the entertainers, is profiting from this event.. Could it be his good buddy and ex Howard Univ school chum Rock Newman who is the promoter or his do all friend David Durham ( sub contractor on the new Police Building & promoter of the May 24th event that was funded by Govt ) who is responsible for the the electronic delivery or his good friends in the ad agency that in reality run our New York Tourism office???

  166. I love his nonsensical statement that Festivals “don’t make profits….” what he doesn’t understand is the difference between not for profit and loss making. Roskilde, Bayreuth etc don’t declare profits but churn millions of dollars into local charities.

  167. So, I’m wrong for defending the party of which I’ve been a member for 40 years. I would be celebrated on this site if I was to agree with most, if not all of you, that the PLP has done nothing in 10 years and that Ewart Brown is a skunk who needs to be ousted immediately. I would be celebrated if I referred to Dr. Brown as E-rat Brown. I would be celebrated if I said that the PLP is neither progressive nor labour. I would be celebrated if I agreed that at the next election we should all work hard and ensure that the UBP gets back in power, after all that party cares more about the ordinary Bermudian than the PLP. Maybe I would be encouraged by the contributors on this site if I called together a few good men and a few good women and started another party, after all third parties seem to do very well in Bermuda.

    I would be celebrated if I admitted that Drummer Boy has got it all right and I don’t have a clue about what I’m talking. Okay, the PLP is a corrupt government. The PLP members of parliament are only there for themselves. The Premier really stole those cedar beams and the splinter in his finger happened when he went to his cedar lined closet looking for his best Armani suit to wear during his meeting with President Bush.

    How dare the leader of the PLP organise an event at the Fairmont to raise funds for his party? Rather than do that, he should have encouraged the branches to have bake sales and potluck suppers, and maybe a bar-b-q or two being we’re now into the summer months. After all, that’s how the Party used to do it back in the days before Ewart Brown had the audacity to challenge the leadership. How dare Ewart Brown be ambitious in his younger days and aspire to be the leader of his country. He should have realized that he is neither Barack Obama, Hilary Clinton or Sir John Swan. Wasn’t it enough that he was a doctor with his own medical practice? And then he had the nerve to open up another clinic!!! That man really thinks he’s the cat’s meow!! He should have just listened to those people on Point Finger Road way back when he wanted to open an office there and they told him this street is no place for doctors’ offices. Why couldn’t he just go and share an office with some other doctors? No, he had to have his own practice and bring in doctors to work for him. And he even has the nerve to bring in white doctors and nurses, and even Indian doctors and nurses. You don’t see any other Bermudian doctors having other doctors working for them, why should he? I bet you David Burt gives him special dispensation.

    Years ago when my youngest son was in his first year of high school he used to say that he wanted to be the Premier of Bermuda one day, but I told him he should know better than to aspire to greatness. After all, I taught him better than that. Just because he won every prize when he graduated from primary school should not have given him the idea that he could lead a country. I had to tell him that he should just be content to sit on one of the many walls in Bermuda. Now he’s got the gall to tell me that he’s going off to the University of London in August to get a Ph.D. in something to do with the environment and energy. I told that boy that if he’s concerned about the environment and energy he should go round to Belco and get a job as a linesman.

    And Vance, if you’re reading this, please don’t respond with nasty comments when people make nasty comments about your mother and other relatives. After all your mother never did a thing for you and your half brother and she deserves to demonized by people like Smoking Gun, Uncle Elvis, Blah Blah, 9P, the Urchin, Renaissance Man, etc etc. You know that I’m still mad at you anyway, talking about you’re going to be a filmmaker and then you go off to all of these schools like London International Film School and Howard University and that other one in Toronto. You know I told you that if you were interested in films you should just get a job at Little Theatre, after all they let black people go there now. It’s not like it used to be when I was growing up. But no, you had to go away, win all those awards and now you talk about you’re an independent filmmaker and you don’t even have a boss telling you what to do. That’s why you like Ewart Brown so much, you’re trying to be just like him, independent of other people and traveling all over the world trying to act like you’re some big-time filmmaker with that Indian girl you married.

    And why should the Premier of the country have body guards? Back in the days of Sir Edward, Sir David, and both Sir Johns (Sharpe and Swan) they had Special Branch protecting them and they were armed, but Dr. Brown needs no protection. After all he is the most loved man in Bermuda. If I were him I would see if I could purchase a mobylette to ride around on, after all that’s how Jack Sharpe travelled about Bermuda. The nerve of Ewart to expect to have bodyguards and a chauffeur-driven BMW just because he’s the premier of this little third-world island.

    Drummer Boy is right, the Premier should have been outside of Parliament waiting for the protesters rather than standing in Parliament giving a Ministerial statement. I mean, after all he has greeted every other protest group that has marched on Parliament, why show such disrespect to the BPSU and BPA. He should have been willing to stand and take the insults that may have been thrown like he did when the “girl soldiers” and the clinic patients marched on parliament.

    The PLP government was wrong not to agree to give civil servants the 1% pay rise now rather than include it in their superannuation package when the reach 65. After all who needs money when they retire?

    How dare the Bermudian policemen to think that they should get housing allowance just because they gave it to those British officers like Christian Dunleavy’s father. Those Bermudian bobbies are now going to start thinking that they’re on equal footing with the likes of Blah Blah and will want to retire to the U.S. like Rummie next.

    Drummer Boy was right to refer to the Premier’s “half-brother” in his brilliant dissertation, after all it’s too much of these Bermudian women having all these children for all these different men and telling their children who their father is. We should go back to the days of the old calypso so that we can sing “you daddy aint your daddy and your daddy don’t know”. If Dr. Brown’s father was a real man, he would have just kept it a secret that he had “outside” children. Illegitimate children should not have the right to know who their fathers are anyway. And by the way, the PLP Government was wrong to change that term in the law. If those children choose to be born outside of a marriage, they should accept that they’re illegitimate and not like other children who have a mommy and a daddy at home.

    And by the way Alsys (or however you spell it) you should continue to voice your discontent and dissatisfaction with Dr. Brown and the PLP. I’m sure that rather than read his Bible before going to bed, Dr. Brown reads Catch a Fire and Bermuda Sucks to get inspiration for the next day. I’m sure he’s noted your comments and is thinking of ways that he could change so that you could like him, even though you never say what it is about him that you don’t like. He is a bit arrogant isn’t he? And listen to how he talks, he never talks like a real Bermudian, he never says “dese” and “dose”, and then sometimes he talks like he swallowed a whole bunch of quarters. Why, he sounds more American that Mrs. Jackson and she was born in America.

    After this post, I really don’t know if I will continue posting on this site, but if any of you want to correspond with me, why don’t you do what “Twiggie” over on Bermuda Sucks used to do and send x-rated anonymous letters to my job. I won’t report you to the police like I reported her because now she doesn’t send me those nice letters anymore about E-rat Brown. Now she only has two ways to spew her venom – on Shirley Dill’s show and Bermuda Sucks, unless of course she’s penning letters directly to E-rat Brown.

    I wonder if the Royal Gazette would be interested in posting this rant like they were in positing Drummer Boy’s piece.

    Warrior Woman

  168. Ms Furbert.

    1. I never said I did not like Dr. Brown, in fact I numerously state how I admire him. I’m not exactly sure how that translates to disliking him but I’m not sure how else to say it in a way that you might understand. Disliking some things he does (as I wrote TWICE in my above posts) does not mean I dislike him. If you wish to paint me with that brush, please give me the courtesy of acknowledging what I actually write and basing your opinion on that. I have defended him on BS when he deserved it.

    2. This is the medium I chose to speak out on. It is not the only one. You assume way too much when you attack people, I have found. Instead of examining the issue, you tend to make things personal and in such, use erroneous information. You don’t know who I am, I give you that but instead of veering on the side of caution, you choose to put me and others in a box that you have no way of knowing whether we fit in to. I do not assume Dr. Brown reads the many blogs but I’m betting he has knowledge of the content on this and the others through those close to him in a professional sense. At least I hope so. In my opinion, information is power and I consider him too intelligent to ignore such.

    I have a healthy dose of respect for Dr. Brown. I love that he is a strong man who is, yes, arrogant and strong-minded. We need strength in order to forge our way forward in this new world. However, with all strengths there must be balance and I see too little compromise in his dealings lately. My opinion. Does it matter to anyone but myself? Not really. But that’s the thing about opinions, everyone has one. And learning to be tolerant and considering others opinions does not make you weak. It makes you stronger. The tree that bends in the storm yet holds its ground is much more enduring that the one that refuses to bend and thusly breaks.

  169. Alsys,

    I really do believe that you are a sincere individual, however I cannot understand how you continue to engage with such hateful people on Bermuda Sucks. The name alone is enough to turn my stomach. From what I’ve been able to glean the host(s) of the site does not reside here, has no vested interest here, yet s/he has given a description of your beautiful homeland as a place that “sucks”. Most of the posters on that site seem to also agree that Bermuda sucks. I see that you try and defend the place of your birth, but you are up against some very nasty people, who not only hate Dr. Brown, the hate the PLP. I can assure you that even if Paula Cox became Premier, they would be saying the same nasty things about her that they’re saying about Dr. Brown. They said it about Jennifer Smith, Alex Scott and now Dr. Brown. Look at why they write about Dame Lois Browne-Evans.
    Go back and read “LETTER FROM BERMUDA: CORRUPT GOV’T VS. INVESTIGATIVE JOURNALISM”. Who do you think wrote that? Do you read the editorials in the Mid Ocean News?

    There has been no evidence that this government is corrupt, but yet we continue to hear, bloggers continue to write about it, and people continue to come on the talk shows saying it. Did you follow the case where Nelson Bascome was charged with corruption? Do you know why it was thrown out of court? Do you know who instigated that case?

    I am old enough to be your mother and I have seen much in this island. I would suggest that you have a heart to heart with your parents and other elders in your family and find out the truth about Bermuda. The truth is not written in the Royal Gazette. It certainly is not written in the Mid Ocean News.

    Tomorrow Gareth Finighan’s front page story will be about corruption in the BIU (again). He will not tell you and other readers that it is because of the BIU that workers in this country (including you) have benefits such as maternity leave, paternity leave, paid sick leave, a 35 hour work week, private company pensions, etc. etc. etc. He will tell you that the BIU’s books have not been audited for x number of years and he will have gotten his information from a disgruntled member of the public who has no inside information and is assuming that the BIU’s books are not audited. Finighan will then tie the BIU and the PLP together and that both organisations are corrupt and that the leaders of both organisations are also corrupt.

    Is he a Bermudian? I’m not sure but if he is not, do I want someone like that living and working in my country. No way in hell!! Bermuda depends on international business and tourism, why would we in Bermuda want someone who is not Bermudian continue to write stuff on a weekly basis that is intended to destroy my country.

    Another suggestion I will make to you, read the following books:

    1. The History of the Bermuda Industrial Union
    2. Lois Browne-Evans, The Grand Dame of Politics
    3. Dr. E.F. Gordon, Hero of the WOrking Class
    4. Second Class Citizens, First Class Men
    6. Sir John Plowman
    7. The House that Jack Built by Jim Woolridge

    After you have read those books,you should be able to see why people like Smoking Gun, Rummy, Uncle Elvis, Twiggie, Loki and others that post on Bermuda Sucks hate Dr. Brown and the PLP so much. You should be able to see why an 87-year old woman (Twiggie) would spend her time writing nasty anonymous letters to me. When I say nasty, believe me I mean nasty. I would not want my grandchildren to come across those letters and read them and people want to criticise Dr. Brown for attending a fundraiser at the Playboy Mansion. I don’t think that anything that I’ve written or spoken deserved the filth that she wrote in those letters about me, my son, and my cousin, Dr. Brown. It’s because of people like her that I’m glad he has body guards.

    By the way, I was able to identify who Twiggie was by reading her posts on Bermuda Sucks and comparing what she wrote in the letters. That how I was able to alert the police. Be careful about posting personal information on that or any other site if you want to remain anonymous.

  170. “Be careful about posting personal information on that or any other site if you want to remain anonymous.”

    Quite. Because, if you do, you’ll have Vance Chapman, Laverne Furbert’s son, cyber-stalking you, writing letters to your employers, alleging that you’re an awful racist who should be fired; and buying shares in your company, solely so he can demand that you be fired. His other ruse is to set up fake hotmail accounts in names such as ‘white power bda’ and ‘white bda’, and write to local bloggers who have been critical of the current Government, saying things such as “you’ve got it right. Fuck those niggers” (please correct me, if that wasn’t the exact quote, Vance, and I’ll get the verbatim transcript for you), in the hope that they’ll respond and he’ll be able to publish the fact that they associate themselves with racists. Unfortunately, for all his racist tendencies and vitriol, Vance doesn’t understand matters such as IP addresses and common tracing protocols.

  171. So Loki,

    It’s wrong for Vanz to do what you allege, but it’s okay for Twiggie to send nasty anonymous letters? I’m just curious.

    LaVerne Furbert

  172. Actually Laverne, I believe the question is just as legitimately asked:

    “It’s wrong for Twiggie to do what you allege, but it’s okay for Vanz to send nasty anonymous letters? I’m just curious.”

    As it appears to be wrong for your relationship to Vanz to be pointed out on this site but ok for both you and your son to talk about someone else’s father?

    Oh I forgot. You wouldn’t call someone a ‘confused negro’ either.

  173. You are circling the wagons again, Mrs. Furbert, when you in fact are on the side of the victors in the political ‘war’.

    Since 1998 the kind of defensive, often race-based, rhetoric which you employ has actually prevented the PLP from growing into its place as a mature political presence. It has alienated a significant group of younger voters.* It has destroyed the goodwill and optimism which so many people expressed with their vote in 1998, and with their optimism following that election. It has meant that the PLP is no closer to representing all of Bermuda than they were before they got elected. It has repeatedly slammed the door in the face of those who want to engage in sincere debate in order to make a better informed political decision. I am not saying that this type of rhetoric is necessarily representative of the PLP – but it is so strident that it overpowers any other message out there.

    Do not assume that people who criticise the government of the day or the Premier are necessarily against the PLP or what it stands for. Do not assume, because of what you think you know about critics, that they are UBP stooges. Do not assume that those you are debating with have not read their history, or talked to their older family members. Don’t assume that they do not appreciate the struggle for basic civil and human rights. Don’t assume that they in any way downplay the hardships and abuses of the past or the role that the past plays in shaping us and our environment today.

    I have read all the books that you are recommending to Alsys, and many more besides on Bermuda history, environment, race and colonialism (including your son’s Daddy and I series, which my kids love). And it is partly because of that that I have voted more often for the PLP than I have for the UBP, and why I still feel the PLP is the party with the most promise. It is most unfortunate for your party that you are such a poor advocate for their vision. It would be better if you said nothing at all.

    You said: Be careful about posting personal information on that or any other site if you want to remain anonymous. That is very good advice. Given your past behaviour (I refer to the notorious incident with the Limey and his family) I read this as a direct threat to Alsys and others who have debated you on this site. Quite frankly, I am scared of you, Mrs. Furbert. In my view, you are well on your way to becoming a Twiggie, and she is obviously an unbalanced and extremely dangerous person.

    Wiith mouse in hand . . .
    Urchin

    ———————
    *If you wonder what I mean by ‘significant’, just consider that the margin of victory in most Bermuda elections has been such that only a very small number of people need to have voted differently, nor not voted at all, for a different outcome.

  174. omg urchin – u r a bore – if u were stupid enuff to vote ubp ever – pls stay that stupid. we’ll do w/o

    mouse n hand…blah…blah…freaking blah

  175. “So Loki,

    It’s wrong for Vanz to do what you allege, but it’s okay for Twiggie to send nasty anonymous letters? I’m just curious.

    LaVerne Furbert”

    No, in case irony and sarcasm just “aren’t your thing”, try noting what ‘The Truth’ stated above. The fact that your racist, scumbag, cyber-stalking son engages in the activities that I described (under the non-cloak of three IP addresses), whilst you bleat about far less sinister and troubling activities, speaks volumes about your priorities. There. Is that explicit enough for you?

  176. Urchin,

    What does circling wagons mean? I was not brought up in the wild, wild west. I know I’m on the side of the victors in the political war, I’m a member of the PLP.

    I would ask you to show me where I have ever mentioned race in any of my posts on this site, or my letters to the editor of the Royal Gazette or my opinion columns in the Workers Voice. I don’t do it. I don’t need to do it. If you believe that the PLP will ever represent all of Bermuda you need to take a Politics 101 class. I don’t know of any political party thas has ever represented all of the voters and I don’t think that the PLP is looking to be the first. The UBP never represented all of the voters and they did not always win with huge majorities.

    Also, please show me where I have ever accused anyone of being a “UBP stooge”. I can say that if those with whom I debate (?) had read the books that I have recommended, I would not be reading comments such as yours. Am I to be flattered that you have more often voted for the PLP than the UBP. How many times is that? I haven’t voted that many times myself and I know I’m much older than you.

    It is most interesting that you noted my “notorious incident with Limey and his family’. Who made it notorious? Did you ever read the Limey’s post about Dr. Brown and his family? Give me a break. Are you saying it is okay for the Limey to make light and threaten Dr. Brown and his family, but it was not okay for me to do the same? How would you like it if someone threatened (or thought about) dropping the waste from an airplane on your house? Is that a pleasant thought? Is that a threatening thought? Or better still, being it’s now summer, how would you feel if you went swimming and someone set a school of sharks upon you. That was such a long time ago (December 2006, I think), that I can’t even remember what the Limey wrote, but I do know that he made threatening and disparaging remarks about a member of my family whom I hold very dear.

    If you are “scared of me” that’s your problem, not mine. I don’t have a criminal record, I don’t believe in corporal punishment and I certainly don’t believe in violence of any sort. To compare me to Twiggie is an insult, especially because you are not privy to the anonymous letters that she wrote to me. If you are, it means that you’re a policeman, or she herself shared them with you.

    As far as the margin of victory, remember one thing, I have lived under the UBP government and survived, in spite of them, and I’ve lived under the PLP government, and survived, in spite of them. I am not one of those people who depend on the Government of the day to determine on how I will live my life.

    I just read vexedbermoothe and I didn’t learn anything. Are you the author? You should already know what I think about anonymous posters. I believe that people should have the courage of their convictions, I always have and always will. And I don’t want to hear that people post anonymously because they feel threaatened. The PLP government is not like the UBP government. The PLP doesn’t call in mortgages and black-ball Bermudians like the UBP did. If you know of any such situations, tell me about them.

  177. LaVerne/ Vanz,

    I recall reading on a limeyinbermuda, that LaVerne had been dismissed from her job at the bank, and found it almost impossible to find employment on the island because of her writings in the (workers voice?). After having gone through that, why would you then try put others through that? Or why repeat the actions of those you where writing about?

  178. I don’t know of any political party thas has ever represented all of the voters and I don’t think that the PLP is looking to be the first.

    So if the PLP are unwilling to represent everyone are you admitting that the party puts the interests of its memebers and suports before the average Bermudian?

    Are you saying it is okay for the Limey to make light and threaten Dr. Brown and his family, but it was not okay for me to do the same?

    Limey made light by attemptig a joke. You make/made threats. Big difference.

    compare me to Twiggie is an insult, especially because you are not privy to the anonymous letters that she wrote to me.

    So are you privy to the hate filled and racist emails your son has sent? If so, do you you support his behavior and are equally disgusted by it given the similar activities of an 87 year old woman?

    The PLP doesn’t call in mortgages and black-ball Bermudians like the UBP did. If you know of any such situations, tell me about them.

    If you know of any situations where the UBP called in mortgages, tell me about them (the last time I looked the UBP hasn’t been issued a banking licence by the BMA).

    I have lived under the UBP government and survived, in spite of them, and I’ve lived under the PLP government, and survived, in spite of them. I am not one of those people who depend on the Government of the day to determine on how I will live my life.

    Given your (albeit sarcastic) remarks above regarding the success of your children it would a reasonable conclusion that your family in fact thrived under a UBP government, not simply survived.

  179. Laverne – after your not so veiled threats against Gareth Finnighan a few posts up are you really surprised people post anonymously?

  180. Exactly Mambochazbaps.

    Ms. Furbert’s call for individuals to sign their real names is astoundingly insincere when both she and her son are well documented as engaging in threats, both veiled and otherwise, against individuals, their employers, families etc..

    Hell, they’ve both done it in this thread alone.

    Nor has she risen to the challenge of addressing her son’s threatening behaviour and defamatory lies.

    Sadly, the ends appears to justify the means in their minds. How they can’t see that they both operate in the same manner as the scoundrels they deplore is beyond me.

  181. Props for printing that letter Vanz. Shame you can’t see the obvious “Fuck Off” embedded in the corporate speak.

    The poor lady who had to clean up after you was telling you to “Shut up and go away” in the politest possible terms. True to form, you’re too blinded by hate to see that.

  182. Ms. Furbert,First of all grow up.

    If you can’t take criticism then get out of the public domain or stop being so divisive and defensive when people pose queries to you. Just because people ask you questions doesn’t mean that they’re are “bashing” you or dislike you. Your reactions are equal to that of a spolied school child. You are striving to be a politician, then act like an adult and stop threatening people that don’t think like you or disagree with some of your points. You do it to your fellow PLP members as well, so i know it isn’t directed solely at non-PLP supporters. The PLP isn’t perfect and never will be, and thus WE have the right to question their actions and motives, the same way if the UBP was in power. But they are not and the PLP is, so deal with opposition. If you hate democracy so much, then move to China.

    All you do is cherry pick every point that you can and never answer the hard questions, and on top of that you blatantly lie (i.e. “i don’t use that term”). But then again yuo are or trying to be a politician. Furthermore the fact that you don’t condemn the nasty racist ways of your son, or I mean Vanz says volumes about your thoughts on the matter. So are you and Vanz of the same mindset? $100 SHE IGNORES THIS ONE!!!

    Read Locke’s “A Letter concerning Toleration.” Because you need to learn that there are two sides to every argument and why it is necessary to tolerate them in order to ensure a progressive society.

  183. $100 SHE IGNORES THIS ONE!!! – You won!!!
    I will ignore that and all others. I will act like a spoilt child and take my marbles and run. It’s quite obvious that I’m not welcome on this site.

  184. But from your posts, I mean rants, you are not in favor of a united and progressive Bermuda it seems. You seek to maintain and increase the divisions of OUR island with your hate filled rhetoric. It seems that this has been passed down to the ever hateful and nasty Vanz as well, and it is individuals like him that hinders the betterment of OUR island.

  185. Mrs. Furbert:

    First of all thank you for responding to my post. As I have said earlier in this thread I appreciate the time you take to engage in dialogue, whether or not we agree. I also admire your courage in using your real name all these years. I will try to respond to your points below.

    I would ask you to show me where I have ever mentioned race in any of my posts on this site, or my letters to the editor of the Royal Gazette or my opinion columns in the Workers Voice. I don’t do it. I don’t need to do it.
    You have caught me out on this one. I don’t have any particular examples right now, but I will re-read what I can lay my hands on, and get back to you – it may take a while though, as your body of work is a large one.

    If you believe that the PLP will ever represent all of Bermuda you need to take a Politics 101 class. I don’t know of any political party thas has ever represented all of the voters and I don’t think that the PLP is looking to be the first. The UBP never represented all of the voters and they did not always win with huge majorities.
    You are certainly right here. However, I feel that the PLP has not taken up the chance that it had, and still has I think, to bring on board younger voters who have not been brought up within a particular party, or have rejected the political allegiance(s) of their parents/family and prefer to think independently. I believe there are a number of young (and older) Bermudians who are wandering in the political wilderness, and if they do vote at all, are voting for the lesser of two evils as they see it. I think the PLP has core values which are more in line with these people’s beliefs but that a defensive style of engagement makes them wary and even repels them.

    Also, please show me where I have ever accused anyone of being a “UBP stooge”.
    As far as I know you have never used those exact words. But I felt that your reference to Chuko/Drummer Boy as a ‘surrogate son of the soil’ was in fact a reference to that sort of behaviour. I base this on my opinion of the Son of the Soil after seeing on TV that he was at UBP HQ waiting for the results after the last election. I apologise if I have misread your comment.

    It is most interesting that you noted my “notorious incident with Limey and his family’. Who made it notorious? Did you ever read the Limey’s post about Dr. Brown and his family?
    I did see it – and like you my memory of it is somewhat sketchy, except that I know I read it as a deliberately extreme, impossible scenario, that was more designed to emphasize frustration than anything else – and it was so ridiculous that I thought it was kind of funny. It was definitely schoolboy humor. I am sorry to hear that you took it and still take it so seriously. However, that comment cannot, in my view, compare in any way to your behaviour in writing to immigration to complain about someone because you disagree with their point of view. Or making their family’s daily whereabouts public presumably so that the potential for them to be harrassed would increase. If there was some other benign purpose for you putting this information out there please say so.

    If you are “scared of me” that’s your problem, not mine. I don’t have a criminal record, I don’t believe in corporal punishment and I certainly don’t believe in violence of any sort. To compare me to Twiggie is an insult, especially because you are not privy to the anonymous letters that she wrote to me. If you are, it means that you’re a policeman, or she herself shared them with you.
    I am glad you don’t believe in violence, etc. but as you know from your comments about the UBP, there are many other ways of threatening people and ruining their lives. Bodily harm is only one. But, as you say, how I feel about your remarks is my problem, not yours.

    As far as the margin of victory, remember one thing, I have lived under the UBP government and survived, in spite of them, and I’ve lived under the PLP government, and survived, in spite of them. I am not one of those people who depend on the Government of the day to determine on how I will live my life. I just read vexedbermoothe and I didn’t learn anything. Are you the author? .
    The government of the day may not ‘determine how you will live your life’, that is up to you, and you have chosen to hold your head high and stick to your convictions whatever the situation. The government of the day does, however, determine the circumstances in which your life is lived, and presumably you feel the PLP provides better circumstances and that is why you support that party. My point in referring you to the post at VexedBermoothes was that the margin of victory appears to come into play when the UK is evaluating independence, whether by referendum or by election. I am not ‘the author’.

    You should already know what I think about anonymous posters. I believe that people should have the courage of their convictions, I always have and always will. And I don’t want to hear that people post anonymously because they feel threaatened. The PLP government is not like the UBP government. The PLP doesn’t call in mortgages and black-ball Bermudians like the UBP did. If you know of any such situations, tell me about them.
    See my comment above regarding your own behaviour. You have written several things in this thread alone that most readers have taken as veiled threats, myself included. Show me where I have alleged that the PLP itself does such things. As far as my experience goes, they don’t. But you do. You may not ‘want to hear’ that people feel threatened, but they do.

  186. Urchin,

    You are repeating the big lie about the PLP. The simple fact that an organisation has “core values” is meaningless when that organisation does not reflect those values in policy.

    I think if you talk to people to find out what they want as a matter of policy, the UBP is at present the correct for a far larger percentage of people than actually voted for them.

  187. Please provide instances or examples where the past UBP Governments “called in a person’s mortgage.” Is that how you conduct business Ms. Furbert? That is by throwing out wild accusations with no truth or evidence to support them.

    Also, I asked a few posts back why the Portuguese community of this island should thank Ms. Cox for us to be able to live in Bermuda? As much as I respect MS. Cox, explain why I should be thankful to her for me being able to reside in Bermuda, when my family dates back in Bermuda to the 1800’s??

    Let me guess, you don’t have an explanation to support your claim as usual. That’s why your posts are simply rants with unfounded claims and accusations. At least your son comes out and says the things he says cause he doesn’t like whites, and then claims everyone else to be racist. What’s your excuse? Or do I even need to ask?

    You constantly are threatening people with expulsion from BDA, your nasty son trying to get individuals fired with unfounded accusations that argue against the PLP, and you wonder why people don’t post with their real name? You two are funny and I am glad that votingpublic decided against you.

  188. Yep … any chance of a meaningful discourse occurring here appears to have been killed … well done!

  189. It’s really difficult to have a meaningful discussion with a person that refuses to answer any questions which are posed to them.

    It is really hard to have a meaningful discussion with an individual that rejects everyone’s pov/opinion with an attitude that we (voters, taxpayers, people etc…)should not have the audacity in the first place to hold the elected officials accountable for their actions and that we don’t know what we are talking about.

    It is really hard to have a meaninful discussion with someone who repeatedly threatens others, due to the difference on opinion, with expulsion and then wonders why people post anonymously!!

    It is really hard to have a meaningful discussion with someone who makes outlandish accusations with no proof of such actions and then when asked to provide evidence acts like they never said it in the first place. Not to mention the blatant lies and subsequent denial.

    It is really hard to have a meaningful discussion with someone when asked a question gets defensive and aggressive which is followed by a nasty rant as to how we are “haters.”

    In the end it is really hard to have a meaningful discussion with Ms. Furbert.

    PS: Don’t leave thsi site Ms. Furbert. Don’t be a coward. Many people have expressed their discontent with Dr. Brown and you don’t see him going anywhere.

  190. “I will ignore that and all others. I will act like a spoilt child and take my marbles and run. It’s quite obvious that I’m not welcome on this site.”

    I’m not sure it LaVerne really typed that or not, but I would like to point out that this is one of, if not the biggest threads on Jonny’s site. And its in no small part to LaVerne.

  191. 9Ps…

    You are quite correct in your observations. As to why LF behaves in that way, I guess comes down to:

    Either – she genuinely believes that they way she works is in the interests of the Govt and the PLP

    or – she is (genuinely) worried about any alternative to a PLP govt based on her history here

    or – she is polititricking – dodging the bullets and the direct questions – attacking as a form of defense – doing what many poiticians do best, i.e. avoiding the truth and the weaknesses. The old adage of not washing one’s dirt laundry etc, comes to mind.

    I also believe that she doesn’t care what people think about her. She has a mission and that is that!

  192. Hello everyone. Just felt like I needed to clear up some facts regarding the comments Ms. Furbert made about my family.

    To recap, they were prompted by a post I made on A Limey In Bermuda on 23 December 2006, titled “Terror Alert”. You can find it here, but I include it in its entirety below:

    “Police have uncovered an al-Qaeda cell that was actively planning terrorist attacks in Bermuda, Immigration Minister Derrick Burgess said last night [irony point]

    Mr. Burgess said that the conspirators were planning to crack jokes of dubious taste at several locations around the Island in an attempt to sow mass panic amongst the citizenry. “No modern democracy post 9/11 would or should, take such jokes lightly or in jest,” said Mr. Burgess. Those arrested allegedly included a Digicel employee who was planning to identify the Premier’s cell phone, currently being repaired by the company, as “that one that the Israelis sent us”; a worker at the Bermuda Aquarium who was to tell co-workers about training a stingray to “do a Steve Irwin” on the Premier next time he went swimming; and an airline pilot who was to joke about ejecting his aircraft’s bathroom waste over the Premier’s residence.

    Mr. Burgess alleged that the members of the group were also responsible for starting the rumours about the tsunami that caused panic among some residents a couple of weeks ago.

    Dr. Brown said that he was “deeply saddened” to learn that Bermuda had become the latest battleground in the war on terror. He said that a no-fly zone would be established over his residence and that a Presidential Body Double and Presidential Cell Phone Answerer would be appointed as soon as possible.”

    As should be obvious (even had the irony point been absent from the end of the first sentence), I was not threatening to kill the Premier with a bomb in his cell phone. I was not threatening to train a stingray to stab him. And I was not threatening to drop frozen airline waste on his house. The Premier wasn’t even the subject of my ridicule.

    The motivation for that post came from the incident with the Australian chef who was deported from Bermuda, without recourse to due process, for joking that he had put arsenic in the Premier’s food. In particular, I was mocking the remark of then-Immigration Minister Derrick Burgess that the chef’s comment was “tantamount to terrorism” (the line “no modern democracy post 9/11 would or should, take such jokes lightly or in jest” that I used in my post was also actually made by Mr. Burgess). In an attempt to highlight the idiocy of his comment, I proposed the existence of an al-Qaeda terrorist cell who were plotting to attack Bermuda – not by flying aircraft into Bermuda’s buildings, but by going around making tasteless jokes about its Premier. My point was that real terrorists do not go around joking about killing people – they just do it.

    So I did not “threaten Dr. Brown and his family” as Ms. Furbert asserts. What is a matter of record, however, is that Ms. Furbert wrote a letter to the Bermuda Sun complaining about my post in which she named my wife and 3-month-old son, stated my wife’s place of work and threatened to have me deported (see the issued dated 29 December 2006):

    “Firstly, although you are married to a Bermudian, you need to be reminded that permission for you to work in Bermuda is still at the behest of the Minister of Immigration and Labour (the Hon. Derrick Burgess, JP, MP). Please refer to the Immigration and Protection Act to confirm this.

    I understand that your wife is a teacher at [my wife’s school here]. Would she (and you, and her parents and friends) consider it a “joke” if the students that she teaches said that they have put arsenic in her lunch bag? Would she (and you, her parents and friends) find it funny if her students had told her that they have trained stingrays “to do a “Steve Irvin” on her the next time she went swimming? Would it be a joke if they said that they had trained the stingray to do a Steve Irvin on her husband and son as well when they went swimming?

    Would Mrs. Wells, the teacher, of primary school students, consider it a joke, if her students told her that they had asked an airline pilot to eject his aircraft’s bathroom waste on her home where she lives with her husband and son [my son’s name here]?

    Further, I don’t know where you work, as you don’t make the information public, but would the CEO of your company be pleased with you if you made the same comments about him as you have made about the Premier of this country?”

    Her questions missed the point of my post. Even if the answer to them was “no” (which would depend on the context in which they were made), I certainly wouldn’t call them “tantamount to terrorism”.

    It’s also worth noting that she followed up this letter with an email to me, in which she said, “I will be writing a formal letter to Minister Burgess regarding your stay in this country as I find your rantings bordering on sedition” (you can find her full email in the comments on the Terror Alert post).

    While it is true that I had previously made the information about my wife and son public on my blog, I felt that for her to put this information in the Sun, whose readership was undoubtedly much larger than my own, was another matter entirely. I also felt that the context in which that information was revealed, given it had no relevance to my post and that she could have made her point just as well by omitting it, could only be interpreted as threatening. Needless to say, other members of my family felt the same way, and were greatly upset by it.

    Ms. Furbert likes to equate this upset with the upset my post caused her. Had my post mentioned Derrick Burgess’ family, or the Premier’s family, she would have had a point. But it did not. I attacked only public figures. A proportionate response from her would have attacked only me.

    That, Ms. Furbert, may be one of the reasons why people look askance at you when you name Jonathan’s place of work; why they find it difficult to respect your request to refrain from mentioning your relationship with one of the other commenters here; and why some choose conceal their identities from you. You can hardly be surprised.

  193. Thank you Mr. Wells for so clearly separating fact from Mrs. Furbert’s absolute fiction. It is clear that unless you are a born Bermudian and a blindly loyal supporter of the PLP, Mrs. Furbert is unwilling and/or incapable of either respecting or considering an alternative point of view.

    As an unsuccessful politician it is hardly surprising her myopic, ill-informed and close-minded perspective has not been rewarded with the honour of a seat in Parliament. Unfortunately, what is not surprising, is the continued support her party places in such narrow mindedness.

  194. One minor point – everyone keeps saying that EB spent $90,000 on a car. Not true. That number is the US price. In order to get a right hand version he had to go to the UK where the price is £65,000, that is $130,000. Even with no upgrades that’s going to be well over $150,000 by the time it’s shipped here. But the Sally Ann doesn’t need a kitchen, does it?

  195. “Blankman Says:
    One minor point – everyone keeps saying that EB spent…zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz

    i see tha cracker brigade has now invaded this site – it’s a shame that ya’ll can’t go out in the real world and voice your concern – rather you smile and keep it bottled up and then go on line like the cyber kkk that u r and bitch there – wow real hard – beyaotches all of you

  196. The “cracker brigade” huh? Sure it’s not more like the Vance Chapman brigade? I’m sure Mr. Starling will be overly impressed with the nature of your postings when he returns to the island, which is in all likelihood is today given the information he provided. Let’s recap, you have posted under other people’s names, acted like a seven year old having a temper tantrum, and now you have pulled out your already used racist cracker brigade comment. Bravo to you Mr. Chapman!

    I also notice that the quality, and sanity, of your comments took a precipitous dive the instant Mr. Starling was off the island. What, afraid that the big bad communist would censor your rantings if you behaved like this in his presence?

  197. Dylan Says:
    July 6, 2008 at 1:55 pm

    The “cracker brigade” huh? Sure it’s not more like thezzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz
    zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz
    zzzz…zzz.zz.z dead from boredom

  198. it’s a shame that ya’ll can’t go out in the real world and voice your concern – rather you smile and keep it bottled up and then go on line like the cyber kkk that u r and bitch there – wow real hard – beyaotches all of you

    Pot … this is the kettle calling.

  199. Nice Vanz … another oportunity for discussion wasted. Can’t you have a discussion without resorting to name calling?

    My appologies Jonnystar … but its got to be done …

    WHAT’S EVERYONE HAVING FOR LUNCH TODAY?

  200. […]Jackson primarily opposed enforcement on the basis that the claim for £300,000 was of such a nebulous nature that there could be no dispute in respect of it. Jackson argued that the claim lacked contractual foundation, was unsupported by any form of detail or analysis, and was nothing more than a single-line demand for £300,000. Jackson also contended that during the course of the adjudication, this claim had become an entirely new claim with the consequence that the adjudicator had no jurisdiction to deal with it.[…]

  201. […]And fourth, there is a focus on Europe in the Democratic view of the world. Roosevelt regarded Germany as the primary threat instead of the Pacific theater in World War II. And in spite of two land wars in Asia during the Cold War, the centerpiece of strategy remained NATO and Europe. The specific details have evolved over the last century, but the Democratic Party — and particularly the Democratic foreign policy establishment — historically has viewed Europe as a permanent interest and partner for the United States.[…]

  202. Pingback: An Update on the March « By Any Means Necessary

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